This is the complete unedited transcript of a tele-seminar conducted by two extremely successful Internet marketers.
There is a lot that you can learn from this transcript it doesn't matter what business model you are using.
Website: Stuarts Green Consulting

Featuring
Mike Filsaime and Russell Brunson
12 Month to Millionaire Bonus Call
Thursday, October 25, 2007


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It is 88 pages in total.


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Mike Filsaime and Russell Brunson
12 Month to Millionaire Bonus Call
Thursday, October 25, 2007

Mike: Welcome everyone. My name is Mike Filsaime. Today we'll be joined by
Russell Brunson. This is the Russell Brunson/Mike Filsaime bonus call
that's taking place on Thursday, October 25, 2007.

We have 1,360 people that qualified to be on this call or get the replay for
this call. We're going to go exactly three hours today. The format of this
call will be as follows:

The first hour we'll be talking about Russell Brunson's business and I'm
going to be asking the questions. It's going to be just a very conversational
call with me interviewing Russell, no holds barred.

We promised that there will be no questions off limits, unless of course
there's some legal issues, but there will be no questions that will be asked
from me to Russell or Russell to me that can't be answered. So we're
going to get pretty intense on this call. It's going to be very very good.

The second hour we're going to turn the tables and Russell is going to
interview me, then from there we're going to open the phone lines for
those of you that dialed in on the premium line, the first line that we gave
you in the forum. That was called the AccuConference line.

What you do is when we open up the lines we'll tell you to press *1. At
that time you go into a queue and you can ask a question and you can
direct it to either myself or to Russell. We'll take about 3-5 minutes to
answer that question for you, and then from there we'll take the next
question.

So when we tell you to press *1 you.ll be able to go into the queue and ask
your questions.
I'm very excited to get started! Russell, are you all set and ready to get
started?

Russell: I'm ready to go. It's going to be fun.
Mike: Yes, it absolutely sure is.

The purpose of this call was to get an update on where Russell Brunson is
with the tactics that he learned from Vincent James. As you all know
listening to this call, Vincent James was someone that Russell Brunson
paid thousand of dollars to get some personal coaching from, and then he
took those recordings and he offered that as The 12-Month Internet
Millionaire, which I think is selling right now, Russell, for $97, right?

Russell: Yes it is.

Mike: Ok. The 12-Month Internet Millionaire was an opportunity for you to hear
from Russell and Vincent James, of Russell getting some strategies that he
could apply to his business almost two years ago.

I thought it would be really great to fast forward to current times and see,
“Ok, great. It.s been two years. We heard all the strategies on that call
from Vincent James. Let.s see what.s going on in your business right
now.”

So that's where we're going to start. What I'm going to do is I'm just
going to go back a little bit with Russell.

My first question is tell us what was SublimeNet? What was Russell
Brunson's business the day before you heard about Vincent James? How
many employees did you have? Where were you working from?

What type of income were you making every single month and what was
the direction and the vision of your company the day before you met
Vincent James?


Russell: That.s a great question. Actually I hadn't thought about that, but
rewinding back I remember when I found out about him. I'd read in a
forum about The 12-Month Millionaire and at the time I completely blew
it off.

I saw someone talking about it and I didn't really pay much attention, and
then came back like a week or two later and people were still talking about
it in the same thread. So I thought, “I've got to figure out what this is,”
and I went and bought it.

About that time my business was just me and I actually had – she still
works with me, her name's Lindsay – she was my first intern. She was
actually dating one of my buddies on the wrestling team and we were both
graduating the same year.

She said, “Hey, I need an internship. Do you want to have an intern?” and
I was like, “Well, yeah, that'd be good.” So she came and started doing an
internship for me and that was my first actual employee.

Now by the end of the year we ended up making I think about $700,000
that year, which by myself out of little basement apartment that we turned
into an office, I was pretty ecstatic and pretty excited.

Mike: Russell, what year is this now? 2005?

Russell: Yes, 2005. It was two years ago.
I think it was the same year that you and I had done the call. We did the
call on January 1, talking about how we were going to try to make $1
million in a year and we did the big huge $2,739.73 per day teleseminar.
I don't know if you remember that or not.

Mike: Yeah, so in 2005 our goal was to make $1 million a year, and we came
close. You were right around $800,000 and I was right around $800,000,
so we set the goal and certainly put it in motion and walked right through
that goal within months right after the point that we wanted it.

Russell: What.s interesting too is when Mike set that goal initially I was like,
“Yeah, that.s a huge goal. I don.t think we'll ever actually hit that.” Then
both of us, because I think we had that in our mind, we got dang close so
that says a lot for setting goals and shooting high.

I remember the first time I met Gary Ambrose on the phone. This was a
year prior to that. He said, “So you're going to make six figures this
year?” and I was like, “Yeah right. There's no way I can make six
figures.” Then I said, “Wait a minute.”

I went back and started going through PayPal and I'd already made over
six figures that year by the time he told me that, because six figures was
such a number that was impossible in my mind, and I'd already achieved it
and didn't even realize it.

So that next year I said, “Ok, seven figures is my new goal,” and we got
close. But during that year it was interesting because I was doing online
marketing and kept doing it. Somewhere around the middle of the year I
kind of got interested in some offline stuff.

What happened is I think it was Memorial Day or Labor Day, one of the
holidays, and my wife and I had just got home from being out to dinner
and we said, “Hey, we're going to go take the whole weekend off and go
travel and do something fun.”

As soon as we came home I walked out of our car and our whole front
yard was completely soaked. It was a huge swamp. I was like, “What in
the world?”

So we went and found out later that one of the pipes had broken in our
lawn and flooded our whole lawn, so the city came out and turned it off. It
ended up we cancelled our trip and I spent the next three days digging a
10-foot hole to dig down to try to figure out how to fix this pipe by
myself.

I was digging this hole, and like two or three days prior to that someone
from Jay Abraham.s office had sent me a course and said, “Hey, you want
to help us promote this course? Here's a copy of it.”

So I got out there and started digging and I put out the CD player, put this
CD in, and started digging. I spent the next three days digging and
listening to Jay Abraham's entire course.

At that point I didn't understand offline marketing. I didn't understand
how it could benefit especially internet marketers. I was like there's no
way. I want to be doing search engines and joint ventures and that was it.

But when they started teaching about some of the offline elements, it got
me so excited. I bought Jay Abraham's stuff. I started buying Dan
Kennedy's stuff. I started getting obsessed with all these offline marketing
ideas and concepts. So that was leading up and that.s right about the time
that I found out about Vincent's book and I bought that.

When I read it I was just – I'm similar to you, Mike, I'm sure – when I
read that I was just like, “Oh my gosh!” It opened a whole new world of
possibilities that I didn't even understand.

We always talk about how cool it is to have a list of 50,000 or 60,000 or
100,000 people and how great that is. You look at what Vince was doing –
at the peak of his business he was adding 40,000 buyers to his list every
single month and they were staying on for an average of four months and
they would fall of his continuity program.


But 40,000 buyers! I was like “Man, if I had a list of 40,000 period I
would have been happy, let alone 40,000 new people every single month,”
and it really got the wheels in my head turning and thinking, “Man, I'm
missing the boat. There's so much more money and so many more people
and so much more that I can do. There's so many more people that I can
affect out there besides the small group of people that are on my email list,
or on the email lists of other internet marketers.”

So we started thinking, “What are ways now we can branch out?” So
that's where I kind of stumbled onto Vince and how it got me so excited
about the possibilities of using offline elements to really ramp up an online
business.

Did you have a chance to read The IM Myth?

Mike: Yeah, I read that completely inside out. Jason in my office had a chance to
read it before me and he had this look of like being upset after he read it. I
was like, “What's up?” and he's like, “Oh man! Just when I think I'm
doing well I read something like this and it makes me realize how
insignificant I am.”

I said, “No, it's not that you're insignificant. It's that there's so much
room for growth.”
He's like, “No, no, don't get me wrong. It was very inspiring. Now I
realize this is really taking marketing to the next level.”

The next question I have for you, Russell, along those lines is now you
read The 12-Month Millionaire and you decide that you're going to start
implementing offline marketing into your marketing.

I know you have a print newsletter that goes out every month. Was that
the original goal for a continuity program to start going offline? Was that
the first thing that you said “That's what we're going to do,” or did you try
other things like, “Let me just do a direct mail to my list for an offer” and
you stumbled onto the newsletter later? I'm just curious how the
newsletter came about.

Russell: Yeah, the newsletter came a little bit later. Actually the very first offline
thing I ever tried was actually for your Butterfly Marketing promotion.
What I did is I just exported everyone who had ever bought something
from me in the past. I think I had like 3,000 people or something like that.
I thought, “You know, I'm going to do something unique.” So we created
a mailing list with an invisible envelope and all this stuff. We had a couple
problems with the promotion.

The first thing is we ordered all these invisible envelopes on eBay and
exported the customer list and printed out labels. I told my secretary, “Can
you mail these out tonight?” and she's like, “Alright, sure.”

I came back the next day and she'd been there all night long and she
stuffed like 13 envelopes. She said, “This is a lot harder to actually stuff
these.”

So I called all my friends and my family members, everyone around there,
and they all came over and we spent about a week straight stuffing these
envelopes.

One thing bad that happened is because of that when people got the
envelopes they missed the launch of your actual product by about a day or
two, but even with that we tracked back the orders that came from those
envelopes and we still averaged about $22 for every envelope we stuck in
the mail to our own customer list.

I was just blown away. I said, “Man, it sucked stuffing all these envelopes,
but every one of those things we put a stamp on gave me $22.”
Mike: And roughly it cost you about $1 to produce and mail out probably.
Russell: Yeah, pretty close to $1. I said, “Man, I.ll stuff envelopes all day if I get
$22 for every one I stuff.” So that was the very first time.

We tried a couple other little things to our customer list, but actually what
happened is – and I.m going to credit two or three different people,
because the idea didn.t come just from one person. It came from a couple
people.

Mike: Let me just do some quick math there for some people, in case they didn't
see what the net profit was.
You had 3,000 people. It cost you $1 to put a stamp on it and the materials
and to get it out there, taking labor aside from employees and help and
everything, but your fixed costs there were $3,000.
You said you averaged $22 per envelope that went out, right? So that
brought in $66,000 in sales and it cost you $3,000. You made $63,000 on
a promotion that you pretty much botched up [laughing]. So even when
you looked at it that way you must have been like, “Wow! Uncharted
territory right there.”

Even though sending an email is free, I don't know that we can just send
out an email and make $63,000 sending an email to a list of 3,000 people
that easily, so that had to be super light bulb time at that point.

Russell: Oh, it.s huge. I hope you guys listening right now are getting the light bulb
too. I mean how many customers do you have shipping information for?

Tonight export that list and send them anything! Send a postcard, send a
letter – I mean you.ve got customers sitting there and they.re getting
bombarded with email every single day. They might have 1,000 emails
every time they open up their email box.

So think about it. For 30 or 40 cents you can get the mailman to hand
deliver your email to your customer and there.s only like 3 every day in
his box. Usually he.s so excited – I know I am – when I get mail I.m so
excited to rip it open and find out what it is. For 50-60 cents you can have
someone hand deliver your email. I mean how powerful is that?

So I recommend really doing that. Like I said, the light bulb went off in
my head and I was like, “Man, there.s more to this. I need to keep
digging.”
We started studying all sorts of direct response courses and there are a
couple guys that really had an impact on me.

One of the first ones was John Alanis. I know you know who John is. He
runs a site called JohnAlanis.com, but what he does is he sells products to
guys who want to have women approach them, to have women approach
you. That's kind of his business about that.

Mike: You and I did a product with him. We were featured in his $30K in 30
Days. He was on that product with us. I had met him at I think it was
Yanik.s Underground Event in 2006.

Russell: Yeah, exactly. I heard him on a teleseminar or something. I don.t even
remember what it was, but I heard him talking about something. He was
talking about direct mail for internet marketers, so I got all excited and
started listening to him.

He said that a lot of times internet marketers, especially guys who are
getting started like we were, they.re really scared to invest money in direct
mail, and rightfully so because a lot of times we don.t know how to write
copy well, we don.t know how to do a bunch of stuff.

He said, “I.m going to show you guys a trick how anyone can make
money with direct mail without any cost whatsoever to you.”
He said, “What I do…” and he told us the story about what he does. He
said, “I write a Secret Report that.s so secretive and so special that I don't
want anyone in the world to know about, so secret I can't put it on the
internet, so controversial the internet can.t handle it.”

So he puts this out there and he says, “If you guys want this report, I.ll
send it to you but I do not want it digital. I don.t want anyone online to get
access to this unless you.re willing to pay shipping and handling. I.ll print
this thing out and I.ll actually ship it to you.”

He said that and when he said that I was like, “Holy cow!” So what
happens is someone will pay you $3-4 shipping and handling. That covers
the cost to print it, to ship it, and to mail it out.

When he said that, a huge light bulb went off in my head and I said, “Man,
I need to create some little things like that I can give away and have
people cover shipping/handling. Then I can test out direct mail for free.”
He started telling stories about how you would do that. He would set up a
free report or free CD and say, “Hey, this is a free CD. It's really
controversial. It's good. Give me your name and email address and pay for
shipping and handling, and I'll ship it out to you.” He started getting lists
of buyer leads, people who would be willing to pay money for this
information.

About the same time I went to Gary Halbert.s site and he had this thing
posted up that said, “If you want to know the #1 secret about internet
marketing, why internet marketing is horrible, put your shipping address
in here and I'll ship you the secret in the mail. Pay me a dollar or two,” or
something like that.

So I paid Gary Halbert a dollar or two and he shipped me out the secret,
and the secret came in the mail. What it said is basically the secret to
internet marketing is you need to get their physical address. He said, “I
just got your physical address and you paid me $2 to ship you this letter.”
He said that was the secret.

I was like, “Oh my gosh, that.s beautiful!” So people are funding it. Gary
Halbert did it, John Alanis did it – these guys are funding their marketing
campaign to people.

You know the secret report can be a sales letter, or a CD or DVD and then
have a sales letter included with it – whatever it is – but I got that. I said,
“I can do that! That.s such an easy way to start doing direct mail.”

We started testing a couple things like that. We did it once or twice and
had really good success with it. We.d get a list of maybe 400-500 people
who had paid for our free report or our free CD.

We did it once where we charged like $10 and said “We.re going to
FedEx this because we don.t want anyone…” so they paid for FedEx to
ship it out to them, and imagine the response rate. People are going to
open, know what I mean, if FedEx comes and brings it.

They actually funded the cost of that, then you put your sales letter and
whatever else in there and you can start testing your copy that way, testing
your offer, to a list of people who are paying you for it, so there.s no risk
involved at all.

Mike: So what were you selling? What was your offer? How were you
monetizing it? You found a way to get the person.s postal address and
they would pay you $6 or $4 or whatever to find out a secret. So right now
you.re pretty much breaking even. You.re making them cover your cost
and you've got their postal address.

But when you sent them the secret information, was there an offer, and if
so what exactly was it in the beginning that you were using to monetize
this campaign?

Russell: Yeah, the CD was related. I did that three or four times. One time Stu
McLaren and I did it. We actually recorded a whole CD talking about
affiliate management. A little while later we actually sold an affiliate
management course, so in the upsell we had a coupon in the package and
then we had part of the sales letter. We had a bunch of testimonials and
stuff that went in the package with it, so that.s one way we sold his.

We did another way where we sold a teleseminar series, and I.ve also
done it to sell an actual seminar, and all three of them have been very
successful.

Mike: Ok great.

Russell: It.s usually a free report or a CD or whatever it is that relates back to the
content of the seminar or the webinar or teleseminar series or whatever it
is, so that way they.re getting a free report about how to get traffic and
then they listen to this report or this CD about traffic, and then by the way
we.re doing this traffic workshop which could really benefit you. We're
going to be discussing the exact same things that are on the report but in a
lot more detail.

I mean think about that person.s curiosity at that point. They go to the
website. They.re so excited that they.re willing to pay $10 just to find out
about it. Then they wait three or four days, then the FedEx guy or UPS
man knocks on the door and hand delivers your envelope.

They rip it open, they listen to the CD, and it.s like Christmas. They get all
excited about the content because they.re part of this whole process and
they've seen the process. They get so excited about it and then at that
point you say, “Hey, there.s more. How would you like more information?

How would you like more value than what we.ve just given you? Well
you can. You can actually come out and meet me and meet this person, or
be on a teleseminar with us,” or whatever it might be. It just continues the
process.

So those buyers, the conversion rate on things like that – it.s not like a 1-
2% conversion rate like you look at a sales letter. You.re getting 15-30%
conversion rate because these guys are….

Mike: You.re getting 15-30% conversion rate? I.m not trying to say this, Russell,
because we.re not selling anything on this call. There.s no product at the
end and I.m not trying to get people excited so that later they say, “Wow,
I.ve got to have it.”

You guys already have the product and here.s the bonus information that
we.re giving. Russell's saying that he.s sending out information to
targeted people and he.s getting 15-30% response rate.

That is just unheard of. You just do not get that with regular email
marketing or with regular online marketing. I've never heard of anything
like that. That.s just incredible, and you were monetizing that with
teleseminars. And did they pay to get on these teleseminars or there was a
product offer at the end of the teleseminar?

Russell: It was usually a teleseminar series they were paying for. They paid for like
10 teleseminars about traffic generation or about whatever it might be.
If you guys start testing stuff and start playing with it, you.re going to find
out that the power of the internet is you can generate leads very easily.

But you generate those leads online and you take them offline where no one
else is talking to them, no one else is communicating with them and
selling to them in that situation and that environment that they.re not used
to, it.s so much easier to sell them.

How many emails do you get a day? How many people actually call you
up on the phone? Our sales force does very very well because they call
people on the phone. How many people get called by an internet marketer
offering to sell them something? Not very many people.

So we're taking them from the state that their barriers are up. People are
used to seeing emails and sales letters and fighting that type of “Oh, here
comes advertising. I want to block it out.”

But when it comes by the postman or UPS or it comes by the phone,
people.s barriers aren't as high and they're more willing to listen. If you
have a good offer, it.s a great way to get that offer to the person.

Mike: Yeah. I.m going to hold off on some of my comments on that stuff for the
second hour. It was to a point where I had to wait to get slapped in the face
until I started doing this stuff.

I think everybody has to go through that. I don.t think anybody just jumps
in and does everything right right out of the gate.
So from there, Russell, you developed a bigger plan, an ongoing
continuity program. So you got an idea to do an offline newsletter.

How many people right now, before we actually get into the strategy of your
offline newsletter, let.s talk about some of the metrics of your offline
newsletter.

How many people are on your offline newsletter? I.ll ask questions for
this next part, if you could rattle off the answer, then I.ll hit you with
another question, rattle off the answer, and then we.ll get back into like
the strategy of how you.re really growing it out.
So how many people are on there right now?

Russell: We currently have 4,100 active subscribers right now to our newsletter.
Mike: 4,100? And what do they pay you every single month?
Russell: They pay $39.97 every single month.

Mike: And I'll do the math here for everybody. $37.97 x 4,000 people, so that's
bringing in $159,000 in residual profit every single month, assuming that
number doesn't go up and down, and we.ll talk about what are those
numbers trending. That.s correct, right?

Russell: Yes it is. It.s a very good thing to have happening every single month.

Mike: Yeah, it really is! Now what are your hard costs for mailing those products
out and roughly to acquire the leads and mail the products out, just on
that?
I.m sure you have back ends and I'm sure that makes you money and you
can even have other ways to monetize things in that report, but as far as
capturing the leads and if you can tell us basically what you pay monthly
to advertise and get the leads, and then how much does it cost to fulfill the
order every month?

Russell: Let.s see, our actual hard costs of the magazine, DVD, and printing and
shipping is a little under $4. Our magazine is a little under $2, our DVD is
like $0.50-.60, and then the printing and shipping – so with everything
about $4 to ship the thing out the door.

As far as our costs to acquire these customers, I would say probably 85-
90% is through joint ventures, which is free. We also have some pay per
click and other media campaigns that are going that the cost isn.t even that
significant, maybe $3,000-4,000 a month.

Mike: Ok, so I.m figuring somewhere around $16,000 to produce it. We.re not
going to talk about your office and your lights and electricity, but let's just
say your campaigns and maybe all that type of nonsense, but as you said
it.s joint ventures and maybe it's costing you let.s say $25,000 to do that.
So you're bringing in somewhere in the neighborhood of around
$130,000-135,000 per month with this campaign.

Now lifetime value – what.s the life of a customer? How long do they
normally stay on with you, for how many months?

Russell: The number of paid months is usually between 3.5 – 4.5 paid months is
the average. Some people have been on since Day 1. Some people have
cancelled immediately, so the last we polled it it was a little less than 4.
It.s like 3.25 paid months.

Mike: Ok. So how many people are coming on every single month and
approximately how many people are coming off? Like was it three months
ago you were at 3,000 and then three months later you.re at 4,000, and in
another three months you.ll go to 5,000? Or has the number been steady or
is it trending slightly down? I.m just curious how those numbers go.

Russell: We.ve done three specific big pushes throughout the year and then a lot of
steady stuff, so what happens during our steady months we.re losing about
400 a month and adding about 800 on a steady month.
Mike: So you.re growing at the rate of about 400 per month?

Russell: Yeah. We.ve had the three big pushes, which each time has added about
1,500-2,000 during each of those pushes.

Mike: Ok, so that.s somewhere around 3,500-4,000 people per year on the
steady, and then maybe a little bit more with some big pushes. Certainly
you have a great opportunity now with The 12-Month Internet Millionaire
getting I think the numbers were close to 9,000 – 10,000 new customers
that I'm sure all go into a marketing funnel and things like that. So those
are some pretty good metrics right there.

Russell, you mentioned something about joint ventures. When you say
that, what do you mean by a joint venture?
I mean obviously nobody says to you, “Hey Russell, let me mail to a page
so I can give away a free CD for you.” So how does a joint venture partner
get introduced to working with you where you get information to send
people a lead for this free CD?

Maybe we can even talk about that, where this free CD comes, or is it that
they.re selling other products for you and then you do this free CD on the
back end and the joint venture partners don.t really have anything to do
with the free CD offer.

Russell: Initially it was more like the second thing you said. They'd promote other
offers and we would go and re-promote the CD. What I found though, and
I know we've had private conversations about this before, but you know
our continuity program is the lifeblood of our company. That.s the most
important thing, so our biggest thing now with joint venture partners is
that what we.re always trying to get them to promote is our free CD
because it gets people into our funnels.

The joint venture partner makes residual income off it, plus they make
commissions on any of the other products that person buys in the future.
It.s such a low barrier of entry and it.s so difficult to have someone sell a
$1,000 course. It.s easy to have someone give away a free CD or a free
DVD offer.

What we.ve found, and every industry is different. We.re doing stuff now
in the fitness industry and the affiliates there are looking for a completely
different thing than this industry. In this industry what people are looking
for a lot more is cross promotions and favors back and forth.

It's real easy to say, “Hey, if you'll help push our CD, in the future we'll
help you with whatever it is that you have going on,” and they don't care
as much about commissions and things like that, so we don.t pay a super
high commission on our offer either.

Now in the fitness industry it.s completely different. People there care a
lot more about the actual commissions and percentages and stuff like that,
so we have to pay a higher percent commission, but usually we don't pay
anything on the back end to those type of affiliates, so it just depends on
the market niche that you're in.

For us, like I said, most of the guys that we.re working with are people
who are looking for cross promotions. For all of our affiliates we do
training and we give out prizes.

With your first DVD you get a certain prize and every month in our
affiliate program we give out different prizes and promotions for people
who gave away more DVDs than last month and things like that, because
that.s the focus of our business. Everything else stems off of that, but
that.s our focus.

If you read The IM Myth, the goal is 1) to acquire someone.s name and
email address, and 2) to find out if they.re a buyer. That.s it, and the
easiest way to do that is with a free + shipping/handling offer.
Mike: That shakes them out right there. That just shakes them out right there.

They needed a credit card or some type of payment to pay for the shipping
and handling, and you just sift it right through there to find that they.re a
qualified buyer.

So your conversion rates are going to be so much higher because they.ve
already shown the ability to….

Russell: And willingness.

Mike: Yeah, and the willingness to reach and grab their wallet or their
pocketbook and get started, so that.s pretty important. Reading The IM
Myth even for myself, that was just like wow.

So Russell, a real quick question, a lot of people may be wondering “How
do I track this all the way through? What type of tracking software is
Russell using? When people get this free CD, how does he know to pay
somebody when they join the newsletter or they buy one of your home
study courses or a software product later?”

Russell: That's a great question. You know the frustration as well as I do. There are
a lot of systems out there that do parts of it or pieces of it. It depends a lot
on what you.re looking for.

A company called InfusionSoft is one that does probably the closest job.
The problem with InfusionSoft is you have to have a Ph.D. in something
to be able to figure out how to use it. It.s very confusing software, but it
tracks everything you need to.

1ShoppingCart is another one. It.s a lot easier to use, but it.s not 100%
reliable. We actually built our own internal system called ClickFusion that
we.ve been using internally for almost a year now. We.re
commercializing it right now and we.re hoping probably in February or
March of next year to be able to roll it out for people to use.

If someone comes in as a customer it tracks it back to the original person,
so if somebody does sign up for your continuity program, then in the
future they buy another program or another product, they.d be
commissioned back to that affiliate.

I'm not sure which ones you use, and we can talk about it more on your
part if you want, or right now, but we.ve been doing that. We used
1ShoppingCart for about 2-1/2 years and got frustrated with some of the
reliability. We tried to use InfusionSoft. I spent about three to four months
trying to figure it out and couldn't.

I decided it was going to be cheaper and easier for me to hire someone to
start from scratch than to try to figure out InfusionSoft.
Mike: Yeah, we.ll talk about it with me as well, but that.s essentially where we
went as well.

You know, your business gets to that point where you start doing
$150,000 a month just there. I mean you have your own products, you
have affiliates promoting your products, you have different niches that
you.re involved in and everything like that.

You start doing $300,000-400,000 per month, you save yourself – I don.t
have to be a slave to these problems anymore. I can hire a programmer to
build me exactly what I want, and then you have employees to manage
those projects and then life becomes a lot easier.

You start out with 1ShoppingCart and I think that.s what you would
probably recommend, Russell, is they start out with 1ShoppingCart before
they try to venture into custom programming something, where they don.t
even have their campaign.

Work on making the product first, get the funnel in place, use
1ShoppingCart. It.ll do probably 95% of everything that you need, right?

Russell: Yup. And they do a really good job. Like I said we used them for 2-1/2
years and we had continuity programs and other things in there, and
they're good. If you.re getting started and want to implement some of this
stuff right away, 1ShoppingCart is probably the easiest and best solution
right now.
Mike: Ok great. Now let me ask you what is your marketing funnel? Let.s talk
first about your internet marketing funnel, and then maybe you can do a
quick recap in your health industry funnel.

I know that you have DotComSecrets.com. Has that now become like if
you were to do a joint venture, just an open joint venture, you meet a
power player at a seminar, you decide to work together – is that where
he's going to drive traffic for you? Is that the start of the Russell Brunson
marketing funnel at this point?

Russell: Yeah, that is. The DVD is the first way we introduce people to it, the
DotComSecrets DVD. When we meet someone and they say, “What do
you have to promote?” and I say “Well, the best thing we have is this
DVD,” and this goes back to the whole philosophy of my business.

It.s not to make more and more money. The philosophy is to provide more
and more value, and that.s kind of key. So if someone.s new, if someone.s
coming from another list to mine, the first thing I want to introduce them
to is my business model.

If you.ve ever seen the DVD, it.s a 2-hour presentation I did at your first
seminar. The night before – I don.t know if you remember this, Mike – I
was there and it was my first time ever speaking, and the night before I
said, “I'm going to do this little workshop.”

I did the workshop and went over my whole business model. I tried to
make the DVD better two or three times and for whatever reason I did
really good that time and it was completely off the top of my head.

But anyway, if somebody.s just coming off a cold email list and getting
introduced to me for the first time, I want them to watch that DVD
because it helps them understand the business and helps them understand
how to create a product, how to set up a website, how to drive traffic –
kind of the whole A-Z format.

So that's the first thing I want them to do, is to get value. So that's the
front of my funnel is that value, which is going to give them a good
overview and help them to have a strong foundation to get started with. So
that's the front of our funnel.

Now immediately afterwards, as soon as somebody.s gotten the DVD,
what we.ve found is if someone gets some kind of website up within the
first week or two of them hearing about us, their success rate triples or
quadruples for whatever reason.

So in my value funnel the first thing I.m going to do, as soon as they get
the free DVD, immediately afterwards I take them to a page where they
can get a website set up.

Mike: Is that the DotcomWebsites or something like that?

Russell: Yeah, we changed the URL. It.s www.FreeAgentPathWebsite.com

Mike: I think everyone that.s on this call, not necessarily listening on the replay,
but everyone that.s on this call right now would have seen that when they
went through The 12 Month Internet Millionaire process, or especially the
IM Myth process, that I know, that when you went through that process
you had an opportunity to get involved in getting the FreeAgentPathWebsite.

I looked at that, Russell, and the first thing I did is I said, “Oh, Russell is
working with…” – you know, there's other sites like that, and then I
realized, “No, I think Russell did the right thing and got away from the
private label and created his own website backend system.” Is that true?

Russell: Yeah, we did, we created our own. A couple reasons why. It basically
gives everyone a really simple affiliate website which has our products.
They become an affiliate for us right off the bat.

The second thing though that our software does that.s unique is it gives
them a squeeze page generator where they can create a million different
squeeze pages that split tests headlines, puts them in a nice template, so
that way they can start building a list with that, and it also builds in a blog
so they can start blogging.

When we teach our system those are the three things you need: a squeeze
page, a blog, and some kind of site that.s advertising affiliate products.
We also give them a huge hosting account. They can have like thousands
of domains on there if they want and that kind of stuff, but it gets them to
have something live online.

As I said, we.ve found that if they have a website up online they.re way
way more likely to succeed. We still have people coming to our seminars
that tell me they.ve been doing this for 3-4 years and they don.t have a
website yet.

I'm like, “Drop everything and get a website up. I don't care if it looks
ugly. I don.t care if it doesn't work. You've just got to get a website up.
Your chances of succeeding are going to be way more if you get a website
up.”

Mike: That was probably a big objection when people were not buying, or if you
were doing follow-up sales, was you were trying to move them
somewhere and the first point to you was, “Well, that all sounds good but I
don't even have a website yet.”

You were reaching a stumbling block right there so you realized, “Let me
get that in their hands very early,” and you noticed that the success rate
just went through the roof, if you can get them to have a website up and
running right away. Now you have something to teach them how to
market, and everything else makes sense.

Russell: Exactly. So the next step of the value funnel is then they get a phone call
from one of the guys in our company and they offer them one-on-one
coaching.
“Ok, you.ve got a website so you know some information about the
business. How would you like to have someone walk with you hand-in-
hand, one-on-one through the process of how to set up your website, how
to get your product in there, how to create your squeeze page, how to drive
traffic,” so they can get a one-on-one coach for 8-10 sessions, depending
on how much they sign up for, but that.s kind of our next step, and that's
what our call center does.

Mike: Ok, let me ask a question right there about this call center. They get a
DVD. They.re told about how they can get a website.
How does the customer connect with the call center? Is there Step 1 do
this, Step 2 do this, Step 3 call and make an appointment for your free 10-
minute consultation, or is it that your call center has the lead, goes through
a lead sheet and says, “I'm going to call this guy. He bought a product
from us two days ago,” and they say, “Surprise, Mr. Jones. I'm following
up on your DVD that you got the other day,” and then they go into a
presentation.

Which way does it work?

Russell: The way we do it is when they order the DVD they get a free 30-minute
phone consultation. That.s one of the bonus offers of the DVD, and we
stole that from Matt Bacak. I.m not going to take credit for that. It was a
great idea.

We tried a call center ahead of time where we just call up people and say,
“Hey, can we sell you something?” and it didn't work, so we stole that
model from Matt with the consultation.

The way we do it is there.s different levels of buyers again. We talked
earlier about qualifying buyers, but we just qualified a free plus shipping
and handling buyer, but if someone buys a website they get a website for
free but they have to pay for hosting, which the hosting account is around
$200.

Now that person who.s paid $200 is more qualified than the person who
paid $7, so our call center guys get the website leads first and we say
“These are our most qualified buyers.”

They call them up and they say, “You just got your website set up. We
want to walk you through and do a coaching process on your website.”

Mike: Ok, so they qualify for a 30-minute consultation, but the call center is
calling them and saying, “This is your 30-minute consultation call.” So
you.re not waiting for the calls to ring into the call center.

Russell: Oh no, you.ll never get people to call if you wait for them. We take them
by the hand, and like I say our A leads are people who are spending more
money obviously, and our B leads are people who spend less.

So we give them to the call center and say, “Ok, our best leads are the
website guys. Let.s call them first. Our second-best leads are the DVD
leads. When we run out of website leads we.ll call the DVD leads.”

Mike: And you put your strongest guys on the website people and you put your
trainees and your weaker guys on the DVD leads I would assume, right?

Russell: Yup. So that.s basically from start to end of our funnel that.s the basic
process. There are other pieces in there too.

So the next thing obviously is when people order the DVD, one thing we
do is we offer a free 30-day trial to our print newsletter, which we talked
about. Just kind of the back-end on what the actual print newsletter is, as
far as our company, this is what I.m most proud of. I mean if you guys
don.t buy any of our products, at least be on our continuity.
This is something that you.d be stupid not to be on it. Not to offend anyone, but
you really would.

What happens is every single month – I pay my employees I think right
now I.m paying about $50,000 per month in employee costs. I've hired the
best of the best.

Some of the guys we're bringing in now – I can.t really mention names
until it's been solifidied and closed – but we're bringing in some of the top
guys in the industry, people who have been working for $100 million per
year information companies, and we.re paying a lot of money to get these
guys in here.

Our copywriters, our project managers, all these people in our company –
I.m spending a lot of money getting them in here. So every single month
what they do is they write an article about what they.re doing for our
company that's working right now – what's working, what's not working.

So what happens is every single month you get access to my copywriter,
you get access to my developers, to my marketers, to my SEO guys, my
pay per click guys – to everyone in my company who.s generating money
for me, you guys get access to them once a month about what we.re doing
right now that.s working.

We compile it every month into a really nice newsletter and we put a DVD
with it, and that.s what our continuity is. So it.s continual training month
in and month out. Every single month you get this and you learn new
strategies, new ways to drive traffics, new ways to provide more value,
new ways to increase your headline copy.

Mike: That's great value, Russell. That really is great value, and that's easy for
you because you're a pioneer and your business has always grown. You
don't stay static, so it's very easy for everyone in your office to create that
content because you.re always learning, like I'm learning from you today
and I hope you'll be learning from me on the next hour as well.

So what better type of newsletter are you having rather than, “Oh man,
what are we going to write around? We spoke about Adwords last week.
Should we talk about eBay this week?”

I mean you just talk about what's working in every department in your
business and it becomes easy content and it.s the best value that you could
provide people.

Russell: Well, it cracks me up too. I listen to some of the people who call for
refunds or returns and it cracks me up when they call and they say, “I paid
$40 for this newsletter and it.s only 44 pages, blah blah blah” and they're
upset. I say, “Well, did you read it?”

“Well, no. I can tell these are just little dorky articles that don't really
work and I get this stuff for free on the forums and blah blah blah,” and
I.m like, “Alright, we.ll process your refund,” and I laugh because they
don.t realize what they're missing out on.

I've got guys who I pay $100,000 per year to manage the marketing in our
company. Those guys are writing the best stuff in their article and giving it
to you. You can.t find that stuff in the forum. You cannot find that stuff
anywhere else, so it makes me laugh. People dismiss it as nothing.

If you dig into that kind of stuff and you read it with an eye, you're going
to pull away at least one idea that.s going to make you money, I guarantee
you, every issue. You.re going to get at least one idea that.s going to make
at least your $44 back and usually a lot more.

That's why I'm so passionate about it and that's why – you know, I heard
Matt Bacak speak one time and I.m a huge believer in this. He said that as
marketers we have a moral obligation to market aggressively to our
customers. If we really believe that our products and services work, if we
really believe that they can change people.s lives, then we have a moral
obligation to market as aggressively as possible to those people.

I strongly believe that. I believe if you get our newsletter in your hand, if
you get my DVD in your hand and you really read those things and study
them and focus on them, that it's going to improve your life, you.re going
to be a better person, a happier person, helping your family out – so that's
why we market so hard.

I have people call and they're upset and say, “Well, I didn't realize that I
was signing up for a newsletter” and things like that, and we understand
that. We refund them and cancel them right away, but I.m not going to
apologize for marketing aggressively because I know that my product will
change people's lives. I want to get it in the hands of as many people as
possible.

If I'm not aggressively marketing, then I'm withholding value from other
people and they're not going to succeed as much because of that.
I'm talking really loud because I have a lot of passion about that, but it.s
important for you guys as marketers, for all of us, if you really believe in
your product that you market aggressively enough to get it into the hands
of people who are trying to learn from you, because you can change
people's lives.

This isn't something that I want just for myself, but you can actually
change people's lives.

Mike: I agree with you and Matt Bacak wholeheartedly there. I want to touch
base on that and find out exactly how aggressive it is, and then I want to
ask a quick follow-up question as to what happens when somebody
actually does submit their postal details to get this CD.

When somebody's at your site, Russell, and they go to
DotComSecrets.com, and anybody can do that right now, my question to
you is the promise right up front is obviously give me your name and
address and I.m going to give you this free DVD.

How obvious is it that they.re signing up for a continuity program? Are
they ticking a box? Have you decided not to use a ticker box? Does it say
anywhere at DotComSecrets.com or does it say later at the shopping cart
that they.re signing up for a continuity program that they pay $6.95 or
whatever it is now, and then we.re going to charge them $39/month the
following month?

Where do you make that obvious to the customer, because I heard you say
some people say “I didn't realize I was signing up for a newsletter” and
you refund them.

Russell: I go way out of my way. In fact we had some guys who were big huge
continuity people who want to push our products, and they won't push
ours because make it so blatantly apparent that we.re charging people.
I know a lot of other marketers who have it in the fine print and things like
that. If you look at my page, I'm there right now, I have 3 paragraphs in
the headline that says, “This is how we.re going to bill you. You have a
30-day trial. You can cancel any time. Here.s our phone number to
cancel.”

Then on the order page it then says it again, how much you.re going to be
billed, when you can order, and then after you order there.s a video of me
standing there holding the magazine.

I say, “Hey, you just ordered your free DVD. I want to remind you that
with your DVD is coming this magazine,” and I show the actual magazine
in my hand.

“This magazine is coming with it. You have a free 30-day trial. If you
don.t want it after 30 days, please call our office and we.ll cancel it for
you. Let me tell you a little about the magazine.”

I tell them about the magazine and then I actually introduce them to the
guy that runs our call center. I say, “This is Garrett here. Expect a call
from someone in his call center. Garrett, tell them what you're going to
talk about when you call them.”

He explains then, “When we call you, this is the process that's going to
happen.” Then afterwards I say, “Now click on the button below and
you.re going to be taken to a website where you get a free website. We've
found most of our students are three times more likely to succeed if they
get a website up in their first week, so we.re going to give you this website
for free. You do have to pay for hosting charges, but the website is yours
for free.”

So three times just in the sales process they see it. One is an actual video
of me explaining it, and then the very first issue of the magazine comes
and on the envelope is a picture of me holding the magazine and the DVD
and it says, “Again, this is your free 30-day trial. If you want to cancel,
please contact our offices. We do not want to bill you if you don't want
it.”

Mike: Plus you don.t want the problems with your credit card company with
getting charge backs, and that's not the reason why you do it. I mean you
do it because you want people to know that this is a value I'm going to
provide you and I want you to know what you.re getting.

I like what you said. You're not trying to hide behind it. You want the
people to know what they.re getting involved in before they get in.

Russell: The thing that I've found is a lot of times if you just give someone, “Hey,
here's this newsletter,” they're not going to buy it and it.s just going to
hold back value.

I mean look at the magazine industry. Look at Sports Illustrated. Do they
sell you Sports Illustrated or do they sell you a huge football clock, and
oh, by the way, you get Sports Illustrated for a year.

If you want to get people in there you.ve got to give them something that
entices them, and that.s why we give away our DVD. That.s something
that.s enticing, and then by the way you get access to this other thing.
When they get the other thing and realize what it is, they.re so grateful
that they sign up for it, where a lot of times they wouldn.t initially just
straight off the bat.

So that's what I mean by marketing aggressively, and I never will say to
do anything unethically, but giving good enough offers that people are
going to be willing to take those.

I saw Matt Bacak do one just recently that I re-bought again. I'm already
on his continuity and I re-bought again because it was so good, just the
initial offer. So it's creating really good offers that get people into the
sales process, get them in there, so you can provide them the most value
possible.

Mike: Ok, so now if somebody goes to DotComSecrets.com and then they scroll
down and then there.s a little icon that says, “Free DVD,” I'm just curious
there, Russell. It looks like something that you were testing.

When I go to that page it says „newlongsqueeze.html.. Is that something
that.s just running 100 miles per hour and didn.t consider maybe making
something like a URL that says something „Limited time special. or „48
hour special. or something along those lines, rather than – to internet
marketers, we read „newlongsqueeze. and we realize, “Oh ok, Russell
changed his squeeze page to a long page instead of a short page and he's
squeezing our information out of us.”

I'm wondering if that.s something that.s like, “Wow, I guess maybe I
should change that….”

Russell: We probably should change it. It.s funny because we.re testing about eight
different pages right now because I.m sure you.ve seen this too. It's
interesting what will convert with joint venture traffic versus pay per click
traffic versus CPA traffic versus like SEO traffic.

Different traffic converts on different types of pages, so we keep rotating
like eight different pages. It.s interesting, like if you go to DotComSecretsDVD.com
right now, that page converts very well through like pay per click and those type
of things, but it doesn't convert very well through joint venture traffic.

Mike: Ok, DotComSecretsDVD.com does better with pay per click traffic and
not as good with JV traffic.

Russell: Yeah, if you notice this is focused more towards the biz opp crowd, like
“A way to make money from home” and it doesn't really tell as much
about my story.

Mike: Yeah, it.s showing screenshots real quick and testimonials – yeah, this
almost looks like more like – I just heard a radio station that was like “Go
to Russell7.com” or something like that. So this is better you.re thinking
for organic and pay per click traffic. Get to the point and…

Russell: Yeah, and joint venture traffic hates this kind of stuff and it has a lot to do
with relationships. If someone.s coming from Google from an ad, they.re
looking for some kind of biz opp opportunity, so we had to shift our offer
to focus on those.

But if someone's coming from an email from you saying, “Hey, this is
Russell. I recommend him,” I don't want to send them to a page like this. I
want to send them to a page that has my story and information about us,
and that will always do better.

So I used to think that all traffic was created equal, but it.s definitely not
and you have to create different types of landing pages and different offers
based on what you.re doing.

We have our first infomercial hitting in January of next year and the way
we.re structuring the offer there is completely different than we.re
structuring it online, so it.s just understand the media and where it.s
coming from and how you structure things is different in each different
type of media.

Mike: Maybe that.ll be an extra call one day, Russell, and we.ll get to your
infomercials.
Now the customer comes to one of these sites, they hit submit, they.ve
been put into a continuity program.

A couple questions I have for you. When they hit submit, after they pay do
you hit them with an upsell or an one-time offer or anything after that, or
do you let the process go from the DVD and let the DVD go out and then
follow up with them later with a phone call?

Russell: We don.t really have a one-time offer. What we.ve been doing is sending
them to the free website page immediately afterwards.

Mike: Ok, so that.s how you can – so the free website offer isn.t something
necessarily – it might be, but it.s not something necessarily that goes out
in the DVD and says, “Hey, after you watch this DVD sign up for a
website.”

You immediately take the opportunity for somebody that.s going to pay
this $6-7 for the DVD, charge their credit card, put them in the continuity
program, and then they hit submit and “Congratulations! Now get a
website and you're more likely to have success” type of page.

Russell: Yeah, exactly. We have a video there explaining it, and then it says “If
you have any questions about your website, Greg.s phone number is on
there. He'll answer the phone,” and just really take away all the risk from
their mind and make it seem very personal and very real, especially with
like a biz opp landing page where it doesn't tell a lot about me.

Those kind of leads didn't convert very well up in the call center because
people didn.t know who I was, so these guys are calling and saying, “Hey,
I'm calling from Russell.s office…” They don't get it.

So that's why immediately afterwards they have a video where then I
introduce myself, introduce the concept, introduce the person calling them,
and that way they build a relationship there and with our call center now,
because I mean we were getting killed.
We'd generate all these leads through pay per click but then no one could
close on the back end.

But now they're closing again on the back end because now that person
gets the relationship afterwards.

Mike: You've got to establish the credibility as to who you are and why you
should listen to me. You know, when I do a presentation on stage, my first
slide is who I am and why you might want to listen to me. That.s very
important because you never want to assume that people know who you
are.

Just because you're like, “Hey, I have so many customers,” but there.s
always people that stumble upon you for the first time, so you always want
to make sure, as Russell was saying, especially coming from this organic
biz opp traffic, to establish credibility before he tries to sell them anything.
That's a great point.

Now another question I have for you, Russell, is for every 100 people that
get a DVD, how many of those people get the hosting for $200, and then I
want to ask you for every 100 people that get the DVD and don.t get the
hosting, how many of those people end up buying something when they
get called, and then what are the conversions with the DVD people.

So I'll ask you first again, if you sell 100 DVDs for shipping and handling,
how many of those people buy the website?

Russell: On average about 12 take the website.

Mike: You have 12 that take the website for every 100. And now that you
have….

Russell: The reason that the process on that is a little confusing is we're actually
thinking of reworking it more to like a Mike Filsaime-style one-time offer
where it makes the order process a lot easier just to get a higher
percentage, but yeah, that's about where we're at right now, about 12%.

Mike: Ok, so now you've got 88 people that paid for the DVD and said, “I'm not
going to do anything until I get the DVD. Let me wait a bit,” and then 12
people do get the website.

Now the call center separates those leads and your guys start calling.
Obviously, Russell, you've learned that if the phone could ring as they hit
their submit button you.re going to have a higher conversion than if you
wait a day, 7 days, 30 days, or a year, which you would never do.

Now I'd probably say when your call center is backed up a little bit you're
probably trying to get the people called within 24-48 hours, right?

Russell: Actually what's interesting is we tried that initially and it didn't work as
well. So one of the guys who works in our call center, he used to work for
two or three call centers in Utah and they have what they call an
incubation period, where they want the marketer to kind of email and do a
couple things like that where they're getting more familiar.

They like a 2- or 3-day incubation period after the order before they call
the person, and they're actually seeing higher results with that, which
really surprised me.

Now in another industry we work with, we worked with a guy that was big
at Lexington Law. Their sales process is different and they found that
immediately, as soon as someone clicks – and they.ve got a floor of 100+
people now – where as soon as someone clicks „submit. on the lead they
get a phone call within like 30 seconds, and they close higher just because
of that type of buyer.

But when you're trying to close someone on like a $5,000 or $10,000
coaching program, we found when there.s a little bit of delay, they have
time to think about it and to watch your DVD. They found if they can get
them to watch the DVD before they call them, they can close like 1 out of
4, where if they haven.t watched it it.s closer to 1 out of 8.

So they.ll actually double the conversion if the person.s gotten the DVD
and watched it.

Mike: I'll give you a quick story. I did The 7-Figure Code workshop in
February, and then we turned that into the DVD course for The 7-Figure
Code, which launched in July. We figured, hey, these people are interested
in running a 7-figure business. Who really is a great guy in business
building that would be a great offer to put into a continuity program?
Richard Schefren.

So we turned our leads over to Rich's call center to call our customers to
go into his coaching program at a discount, where they got the first month
for free.

It absolutely bombed when we first started that, because every single
person said, “Well, you know, let me get the DVDs first before I do
anything.”

The call campaign went for two days and then we decided to wait six
weeks, and then we tried again in six weeks and had much better success
because everybody had their DVDs and they had a point of reference and
they had no objection to say, “Well, I just paid for the DVDs so let me get
started.” So that was a learning experience as well.

So I guess that.s going to change depending on whether it.s a DVD course
or what the information promised, so that.s a good point.
How many people are in your call center right now, Russell?

Russell: I think up there now, let's see, it's nice, it's hands-free for me. I've got
guys that run it all and they hire and fire. I think right now they have 8, the
last I saw.

Mike: Wow, and how many outgoing calls are being made a day, if you had to
guess?

Russell: Oh, that.s a good question. I wish I had their stat sheet right now, I would
know better. A lot depends on the type of lead. A good call guy might
only have three calls a day if he gets hold of all of them, where it could be
50-60 calls – with my stuff in the internet marketing industry a lot more
people are home during the day, so they get a lot more as opposed to some
other industries where people are working all day and nighttime is the only
time, so they spend a lot of time on the phone with guys.

We usually give – I wish I had the numbers in front of me – they might
give you 10 leads and the caller will work on those 10 names for three or
four days before he comes back and gets more.

So the volume of calls going out isn.t quite as high as I want. In fact,
because we just added 9,000 new leads we.re ramping up our call center
now to handle that.

Mike: Yeah, certainly. Do you outsource that? At any time do you say, “Wow, I
don't want these leads to get too old. Let me use a friend over here, but
they've got to sell it my way.”
Do you do that or do you have guys on hand?

Russell: Yeah. What we.re doing right now is all our international leads we.re
outsourcing to another call center just because it.s a lot easier for our guys
just to call the internal ones. So all the international ones we outsource to
another call center, and you.re right – same thing – we help them design a
program so they.re selling our program, not some program off the shelf
type thing.

Mike: Real quick side question – do you test any crazy metrics like by countries?
Like you do better in New Zealand than you do in Australia, or you do
better in the U.K. than you do in Canada, or you do better in Australia than
you do in Singapore, or anything like that?

Russell: I haven.t had a chance to test any of that kind of stuff yet. It'll be
interesting. We've been getting more and more international leads to other
countries. I'm going to go back now and start running some reports, but
I'm not sure how it converts based on each country. That would be really
interesting to see. Have you run numbers like that?

Mike: Well, I've recently become aware of it because somebody told me that
their New Zealand has the highest rate. I was like, “You've got to be
kidding me,” so it's just a question or information that was given to me
that made me ask you that question, but no, I have not tested it.

I had the same reaction, like Marlon Sanders was like “Mike, you've got
to make sure that…” – he mentioned it on the Next Internet Millionaire
DVDs – “if you.ve got better buyers in California than you do in Kansas,
then put your best guys to call people in California because California and
Florida have the best buyers,” and he's going crazy like that, so that also
helped me to realize that there's other ways to mine the data.

I'll give you another quick tip, Russell, as we're crossing the hour, even
though we started with your first question at 5 after, so we've got another
3-4 minutes.

Here's something that we were struggling with. We've got to get the
people on the phone, right? Then you learn the call center needs a person
here at night or whatever the case is.

So what we were doing on our sheets, we made the phone number
mandatory so we were making home phone mandatory, an optional work
phone, and an optional cell or mobile phone.

The truth is that people don't pick up their phones at home. We just don't.
We have caller ID, we have answering machines, and we play the screen
game. We just do not like to be bothered.

We work hard, we get home, we're exhausted, we're eating dinner, we're
watching Family Guy cartoons or whatever we.re watching, and the next
thing you know the phone rings and it.s like “Who is it?”
“It says something on here…”

“Let it go to the machine,” and it.s tougher to get people on the phone
these days. This came from my car dealership background. We didn.t
want the home phone number, we wanted the cell phone number, or the
mobile phone number as they say internationally.

So what we started doing now on our call registration page is we started
saying „Best phone. and made that mandatory .Then we put „Home or
mobile phone ok.. Then after that we just put „Alternate phone #1” and
„Alternate phone #2.”

So we're asking for "Best phone". instead of "Home phone".. When we did
that, immediately the very next set of leads that started coming in we were
contacting people and hearing, “Oh, you got me on my cell phone,” but at
least we got the people right there, whether they were at work or on their
lunch hour or in their car or at home on their cell, or whatever the case was.

We noticed that when we put "Best phone". people were putting in their
cell phone because we don't make three phone numbers mandatory. I
don't know how many phone numbers you make mandatory in your order
process, but we found now not to use "Home phone". and to use "Best
phone". is working better for us to contact people.

Russell: That.s very interesting. I.m going to steal that. I appreciate that. [laughing]

Mike: [laughing] You got it.
So last question I'm going to ask you here, Russell, and then I'll ask a
wrap-up question.

It's a metric question. It goes to when you call the people on the DVDs
and then you call the people that bought the DVD and the website for
$200, for every 100 people in both scenarios, what type of success
conversions are you having and what are they buying? What are your
offers?

Russell: A lot of times, and I.m sure you've seen this too, we don't get correct
phone numbers and stuff like that. We get fake phone numbers, so the
people we actually talk to on the phone from a DVD lead, we're closing 1
out of 8, if we can get people to actually talk to.

Mike: And what are they buying?

Russell: And real quick, if they got a website also it.s usually about 1 out of 4.

Mike: Ok, so it's double.

Russell: And then what they're getting, the way that it works upstairs in our call
center, we built like an ala carte type thing. We have a couple different
things they can add in, depending on what exactly the person wants. They
kind of cater to it, but the bulk of what they.re getting is some kind of one-
on-one coaching.

Our head one-on-one coach is Nick. He's worked with me for about
almost two years now so he knows our system in and out, so he does our
one-on-one coaching right now where you schedule an hour of time and he
does an hour with you and then he gives you a homework assignment.

You're not allowed on your next call until you finish your homework
assignment. The first homework assignment gets your squeeze page up,
and then the second homework assignment is the next thing, so that way
by the time you get your 8 calls done you.re making money. Otherwise
you don't get the call 8. There's a step-by-step process.

Mike: He must be a very busy man.

Russell: Yeah. He's got his own secretary who manages everything, but yeah,
that's the biggest process, the one that costs the most. But you.re getting
one-on-one with an actual someone.

They're developing now kind of a one-on-many where we.ll have a group
of like five or six students at a time with one coach, which is a little
cheaper but you still get kind of the same personal attention, just you.re in
a group of four or five at a time.

Mike: What do they pay for those 8 hours, the one-one-one?

Russell: It's usually between $3,500 and 5,000, depending again on how many
sessions they have. We usually give people a ticket to whatever our next
upcoming seminar is. It.s fun to just have everyone go through and have a
chance to come and meet with us.

Mike: Ah, so they get a free ticket to a seminar.

Russell: Yup, the next seminar we have going on they get a chance to come to that
seminar, and then let.s see, what else – depending on what they need
we'll set up websites.

We're starting another whole „done for you. section of our company
where people just want to make money and don.t want to do anything.
We'll actually create the squeeze page, the landing pages, we.ll drive
traffic and that kind of stuff.

We're developing that right now but it.s not quite finished yet, so that.s
kind of the next progression where we'll actually do it for you, and that's a
lot more expensive. But again there.s a group of people out there who
want it but they don.t want to do it and they.re willing to pay a lot more
for it, so that.s kind of the other thing that we.re offering to people.

Mike: Ok, and you.ve got down-sell packages as well? How low do you go? Do
you go down to like $497 or $997? I.m just curious how low you go.

Russell: Yeah, I think the lowest is about $497, which is like a course type thing,
so that.s the lowest.

Mike: And you do payment plans for the higher packages?

Russell: Yeah they do, they set up payment plans, and then the other thing that's
kind of cool that we started, we started this new thing that.s like our
instant guru program.

We're picking special people from our coaching group – in fact, after this
call I.m making a call to one guy who.s going to be hopefully excited to
know this. He has no idea it's coming yet.

But it's a program where we actually fly a group of about 4-5 people out
to Boise at a time and we spend 3 days where our entire company is
focused on their project. We build the website, we build the landing page,
and they actually become partners with us where if it.s an idea that I like
or I believe in, I think it'll go really big, we set up a business where that
person and I are partners.

They become the face, they become the guru of the company, and we kind
of sit behind and help them create the launch and build the company.
This is like my big continuity program where I get 50% of the company,
so this person gets to where he.s making $100,000 a month and I.m
making $50,000 a month continuity. If I have 10, 20 or 30 people in that,
it becomes very exciting. So that.s kind of the next process.

In fact, we have our first one coming up November 28-30. We've got
almost all 7 of the first spots filled up. Again, these are just people who go
through our coaching who have some kind of really good idea or program
that we believe in and think that we.d like to be partners with them on it.

Mike: Great. How many employees do you have now, Russell?

Russell: We've been letting people go as we get better and better, and I think
you've probably seen the same thing. Initially I hired a lot of less qualified
people. At our peak we had 15 people internal.

Now I've been firing a lot of people and hiring a lot more expensive but
people who can do the work of 3-4 people. I think right now we have 9
internal and we.ve got 8 upstairs in our call center and 4 overseas, so what
is that, 21 total?

Mike: Yeah ok, great. And your projection for 2008? What.s your prediction?

Russell: As far as dollar amounts? I pretty safely think that we should be able – I
mean my goal is to hit $10 million next year. I'm pretty sure we.ll be able
to hit that unless something weird happens.

Mike: I tell you, we run on the same track, Russell. It's just amazing as far as
goals and direction. It.s just a pleasure to talk to you. I'm so inspired by
you. I learn from you, you motivate me, and this call is really for me just
to steal all your stuff, so we.re going to flip the tables in this hour now.

Is there anything that you would like to close with before we turn the
tables and we put my toes to the fire and let you ask your questions?

Russell: The only thing I really want to say, guys when you.re designing your
business, first off don.t design a product, design a business. We talk a lot
about this and The 7 Figure Code talks about it, the workshop I did talks
about it, but don.t develop a product, develop a business.

The goal of your business should not be to make money. The goal of your
business should be to provide value for your customers. The more value
you provide, the more money you.ll make.

When we shifted our focus from how much money we were making to
what.s the best way we can provide value, what else can we give to them,
can we give them coaching, what value can we give them – that.s when
we started making money that you can brag about, whereas when we were
focusing on how much money can we make it wasn.t like that.

Your company should be value-based driven. How much value can I offer
these people, and the more value you offer the more money you'll make,
and that's just kind of the closing words that I.d like to say to everybody.

Mike: That's excellent, Russell. I want to echo that. When people say, “What's
the easiest way to make money?” the answer is “The easiest and fastest
way to make money is to take a gun, go to a bank or go to a 7-11 and point
the gun at somebody and say, „Give me all your money. and you could
walk away with $6,000 probably in the next 10 minutes, depending how
close you are to a 7-11.”

The problem is it's the wrong question. As Russell said, the right question
that you want to ask is “How can I provide value to this world?” and
money is a by-product of providing value.

So that's a great point, Russell. I think that's going to really strike a chord
with people and it.s a great way to end.

So the ball is in your court, my friend.

Russell: Now it's my turn. I'm excited!
Ok, you've seen my list of questions ahead of time. I hope you guys are
taking notes. The stuff I'm going to be asking Mike now is stuff that's not
transparent.

Lots of what you see Mike doing in this business everyone has a chance to
see. There are a lot of things he's doing that none of you guys see. I know
a little bit about it, so I really want to dig into behind the scenes, behind
everything, what else is going on, what else is making you the money.

So my first question is I know there are a lot of ways you generate leads,
but what are some of the ways you.re generating leads that we might not
see or might not know that you.re doing right now?

Mike: The ones that aren't transparent – and I'll throw the term out there for the
very first time – I'll call it Butterfly Marketing 2.0. Certainly again it's
nothing that I invented. It.s just something that I'm pioneering so hard
with technology right now.

Originally Butterfly Marketing, which I still do, was go out, create free
offers, provide value for free, and then upsell them on a greater value. So
give away a can of Coke and when they like the way the Coke tastes give
them an opportunity get a whole case of Coca Cola for the price of 3 cans
and build a customer base from there.

So that was the original formula for Butterfly Marketing, and I still do it
with probably 11 different Butterfly Marketing style sites that are out
there.

The transparent ways, the ways that are obvious that I get leads, are
certainly from Butterfly Marketing, from organic traffic to my website and
my newsletter, and from selling products and software where people give
their name and email address, either at a landing page or as a customer,
which I.m going to try to make into a super-customer.

The ways that aren.t transparent, to answer that question, is something that
we.re doing right now. It.s so interesting that we.re talking about it on this
call because I did say to so many of my marketing friends that I will never
ever talk about this, not for awhile, because I see it as too powerful.

What we.re talking about is using real estate of other people.s websites.
There.s only so much of this real estate.
Now what type of real estate is there out there? People have review sites,
they have blogs, they have websites – I call that living right in Kansas
where houses are very affordable.

The real estate that I'm talking about is beachfront property real estate.
What type of real estate is that? That's Russell Brunson's thank-you page
for 12 Month Internet Millionaire where 9,000 customers went through in
a matter of six days. That.s right there, right on the beach there in Miami
Beach, a $2.5 million - $10 million type of house real estate that I want to
own or put a billboard on, if I could really say it that way.

So what I.ve done, Russell, is I've created a technology that we.re now
using. We were about a week late before we could even ask you to use it
for 12 Month Internet Millionaire but we did have the old-style way that
you and I have been working together that we did with The IM Myth. I
appreciate you helping us out that way.

What I do is I have a website called www.HyperJava.com. We've
developed proprietary technology.

We have set it up where we can license other people to have an admin
account like me, but I don't know that I would even sell that right now for
$997/month, only because it's just such a powerful marketing plan and I
want to make sure that we're getting out there on as much real estate as we
can, and we want to make sure that we provide the best products and
conversions for other marketers out there. So we've developed this
technology which helps them and helps us.

Here how HyperJava works. What we do is we have a number of different
products. We have software products, we have ebooks, we have home
study products, and we have traffic products.

Traffic products are ListDotCom, InstantBuzz, FreeAdvertisingBlog, older
sites like MyViralAds or DontTouchMyAds, but we focus on ListDotCom
and InstantBuzz because those are the sites that can really provide really
good quality traffic for people. We have a lot of unused inventory that can
be exploited for us to sell and really give people a good return on
investment.

So what we'll do is we'll talk with somebody and it's a great opportunity
because we have a lot of people coming to us all the time and saying,
“Mike, can you promote for us?”

So rather than saying, “Yeah, I.ll promote for you if you send an email for
my product next week, because we have a product coming out,” I.ve not
been focusing on massive joint venture launches basically since February
of this year. The last couple of launches, if you saw, Russell, we did
JobCrusher and I had two people email for that because they asked me to,
and I did that entire campaign myself.

I'm not asking people as much to promote for me as when they ask me to
promote for them I say, “I'll do it on one condition, and that's you let me
sign you up for a HyperJava account and put an offer on your thank-you
page. What I'll do is I.ll show you how you can turn $100,000 into
$150,000, or I.ll show you how you can turn $500,000 into $800,000,
simply by putting one line of code on your thank-you page.”

They're like, “Yeah, sure! So you.ll mail out for me and I can make more
money?”
“Absolutely.” Then I try to negotiate a quality position up on the page.
So what we did is we created HyperJava which allows me to create a
custom campaign. I can say to you, “Well Russell, tell me about your
customer. Are they a newbie or are they an advanced marketer? Are these
people very SEO-savvy, Adwords-savvy, or are they just newbies that just
bought that website?”

Once I know what that is, I know what that person is looking for and I can
craft an offer for that. So here.s what I would tell everybody if they want
to see what that offer looks like.

I have a test offer that.s working right now at ListDotCom.com. Don.t
rush there right now because if we have 700-800 people all trying to create

an account right now we'll probably crash the server, believe it or not. The
internet is not made for 700 people hitting a database at one time, but do it
in the next 10-15 minutes. Don.t rush to it right now.

If you have an account, just log in. If you don.t, then sign up and you.ll
see the one-time offer. You don.t have to buy it or anything like that.
What you will see on the landing page in the members area is an offer.

What I did here is I created a ridiculous offer and I.m testing and we're
getting a very very high conversion rate on this right now.
What I wanted to do is I wanted to see how did it work just on a free page,
so that I could take this data and go to Russell and say, “Hey, here's a
page where 95% of the people are free and it.s converting at 2.6%.”

It.s a ridiculous offer, I.ll tell you right now. I think I.m giving away $479
of InstantBuzz credits, an elite membership to InstantBuzz, the Butterfly
Marketing Manuscript, Powerlink Generator and ViralFriendGenerator for
$57.

I wanted to really just see how bad can I exploit this type of offer if I
really really wanted to create value. We have a very good conversion rate
on that.

So what we've done, Russell, is already there.s probably been 16 different
marketers in the last two weeks that have a launch coming out or will be
having a launch coming out.

I don't have to tell you, I mean I could just rattle them off, right? Rich
Schefren asked me to promote for Jay Abraham, Dr. Mike Woo-Ming and
Howard Schwartz and Harris Fellman with Lead Supreme, Jermaine
Griggs with Nitty Gritty Marketing – there.s always two to three product
launches every week.

So what we're doing is we.re qualifying what type of buyer do they have,
and I go in and I create an offer. I say “You can get these two products for
this, or you can get these three products or these four products, or this
home study course,” or whatever the case is, depending on the target
market.

I create the campaign and then all I simply do from there is I put in your
name, your email address, and I create a password for you. It sends you an
email and it says, “Russell, you just created an account at HyperJava.
Your user name is Russell Brunson. This is your password. Log in, make
sure you change your password. Put your PayPal email address, your
PayDotCom ID, your ClickBank ID, and you.ll find a campaign where
you can take the line of code, and simply put it on your thank-you page.”

Now what HyperJava does for me, Russell, is allows me to get intelligence
data. If I see your conversion rates are way too high or something, I can go
right into my admin and change the price from $57 to $77. I can split test
the ad. I can split test the headline on the ad. I can split test the price on
the ad.

I can also see how many impressions Russell is getting, Gary Ambrose is
getting, Keith Wellman – I can see how many impressions they're getting
every single day and the conversion rates that they.re getting, and the
URL that the page is on.

I can see trends that I'm getting 700 impressions, 700 impressions, 700
impressions, 700 impressions – and then all of a sudden 0, 0, 0, 0, 0.
Now maybe I made a deal with a marketer where I will promote their
product inside of my membership area if they promote this product inside
their membership area, and then all of a sudden they pulled it out.
Then I can contact them. With static offers I would never know.
With HyperJava it tells me they stopped promoting my offer and are no longer
doing the deal.

I can call them up and say, “Hey, what happened?” and they can give me a
very legitimate answer.
“You know what happened? Last week our website crashed and we had to
do a back-up, and the only back-up we had was 45 days old, so I didn't
even realize we have an old thank-you page on there, Mike, and that's
why. Thanks for reminding me.”

Or they may just say, “You know what, Mike, your offer was converting
great. It gave me such an idea that I've put my own offer on there or I.m
testing another offer,” or whatever the case is.

And I can say, “Ok, great. Fair enough. Well, obviously you understand I
have to take your ads out of ListDotCom.”
“Oh, ok. Alright, I'll put it back on.”
So that gives us that type of intelligence.

So not to make this question go too long, Russell, so the way that we.re
generating leads right now is from other people.s thank-you pages.
There.s always a launch.

We spoke about it last year, The Death of Internet Marketing. We called it
the October Effect. Jeff Walker just spoke about the best times to launch a
product and he mentioned some pretty good months and everything like
that.

We saw it again. There was an October Effect this month and you were
part of it. You launched a product in October this year, so I didn't care that
I missed out on potentially having an opportunity to work with you on
that, because I know there.s always going to be a launch and we can work
together again in the future and things like that.

So that's my way right now.

I.'l give you another example. A friend of yours and mine, Michael
Rasmussen, his strategy used to be get as many testimonials as you can out
there driving traffic for FreeAdvertisingForum and he built a tremendous
list. What he did with that was just incredible.

Then he created another product called EmailPromosExposed, which is a
Butterfly Marketing site. He's made well over $1 million just with this one
site, and he's got an email list from this site of over 80,000 people.
Those are estimated numbers based on a trend of numbers that he gave me
about seven months ago. I just want to let everybody know that.

But with that, what I've noticed is every single time I go to somebody's
thank-you page I see an offer from him for a free offer for EmailPromosExposed.
Mike knows this idea. If he's on the call right now he's probably saying,
“Why is Mike giving away my best secret?” But we said you ask the
questions and we're going to tell.

The Butterfly Marketing 2.0 thing is for me to say what better customer
than somebody that just checked out at the register and still has their credit
card out. Make them a real valuable offer, and now I've taken that
customer and immediately put them into my marketing funnel, and now
we.ve created advanced technology.

And why, Russell, do we ask for your PayDotCom ID and your ClickBank
ID? Because what it does is I can then tell you that when they buy this
we.re going to upsell them to this, this, this, and this. And even if the
stumble around my website and buy any of these products, you.re still
going to get paid as well because we drop your affiliate cookie for our
different products as they go through the process, and it also provides us
tracking.

There's a real quick question I wanted to ask you. Do you pay your joint
venture partners on sales made through your call center? Always, some of
the time, or never?

Russell: We did once, because we had one guy say that he.d only promote if we
tracked that back, so we have once but we don.t have anything in place
really to track it right now, so it's very difficult to.

Mike: Yeah, and that.s part of the technology that we.re developing to track
through our CRM software. Just so you know, Russell, a great resource if
you.re not aware of it, in my opinion one of the leading companies in
development right now is called 37 Signals. You can go to 37Signals.com.

You've heard of BaseCamp, Russell, for project management? They
recently came out with something called HighRise, and these people
design the easiest to use software in the world. The mastermind that I.m in
just recently told me that they just added this product called HighRise.
It's CRM software.

If you like BaseCamp and it.s easy to use, and you know it is, they just
came out with a kick butt CRM software, which we were having a little bit
of trouble using another CRM software that we were trying to integrate
with our leads for our call center.

Now we.re going to use this HighRise. We.ve checked it out. It.s
absolutely phenomenal and easy to integrate with our current data from
what we looked at, and we.re really excited to start using that.

We.re going to use that and we have data that.s coming in that.s going to
post into this software. It.s going to say that this lead came from Russell
Brunson and we.re going to be paying 10-15% in our call center on our
back end for sales that come through our call center.

Russell: That.s awesome. I.m going to look into it after the call. That obviously
would be a great selling point for your joint venture partners, if you could
track it all the way back and give them a piece of everything. That would
be awesome.

I had one other idea while you were talking that I know I.ve seen Tellman
Knudson do with leads. You were talking about the thank-you page real
estate and how powerful it is. He.s talked about the email real estate and
how powerful it is.

I've seen him do a lot of things where he's trying to switch Day 3 of your
autoresponder to throw in my message, and Day 3 I.ll put in your
message, back and forth. That.s another great way. He.s trading real estate
in people.s email box or in their autoresponder series.

Mike: Yeah, absolutely. In fact I do that with Tellman. The nice thing like with
HyperJava is we can not only put html code on a website, we can also
create a link that builds a page with that html code on it.

So what we can do is if we make a deal with someone like Tellman where
we.re going to promote their product in Day 3, I.m not saying Tellman but
let.s say a marketer – again, there.s only so much real estate and
everybody.s always trying to make a deal.

Maybe you come along and say, “Hey, I need you to do this. Put this in
your autoresponder in Day 3,” and then the other marketer says, “Ok,
sheesh, I really need to put Russell there and I really like this on Day 4
and I'd like this on Day 8. I.m going to move Mike to Day 9.”
HyperJava will show me that I was getting 19 clicks a day and now I'm
down to 3 clicks a day because I.m way down at the end of the responder.

That sets off a flag, we can opt in and we can test it and say, “Hey, we
made a deal that I.ll send you out on Day 3 if you send me out on Day 3.
You.re no longer promoting my product.”

“Yeah, we had to move you to Day 9.”
“Well, then you.ve got to move me back up.” Because it.s not fair to be
promoting somebody else.s product in your autoresponder on a deal that
they said they would do the same, so the nice thing about HyperJava is it
gives us that technology to track that our campaigns are still working with
people that promised us they would.

Russell: Cool. Ok, we.re 28 minutes and we.ve got one question down, so we.re
going to have to speed up to get through all of this. [laughing]
Ok, the next one here – we talked a little bit about the life cycle of my
lead, where someone signs up for my newsletter initially where do they go
throughout the process. Can you maybe touch upon that for a little bit of
what the life cycle of one of your leads is?

Mike: Right now we don.t have a continuity program that.s being offered like
you do, Russell. We.re looking to the development of an offline
newsletter, but we.re focusing right now quite frankly on our continuity.
We have one site coming out next week, but right now we.re focusing on
JobCrusher and Vtribes, which is Vision Gate Portal being rebranded,
which is launching the first week of November.

So the focus in my company right now on continuity is going into those
programs, and then hopefully with some of the stuff that we.ve learned
from you today I can take some of your ideas and possibly come up with a
free DVD offer and newsletter. You gave some tremendous information
on that.

What really happens in our business is as you know, Russell, I.ve
announced that I.ve retired from public speaking so I no longer will be
traveling and you can never see me again at another event, with the
exception of the two events that are still on my calendar. I.m not going to
be speaking again maybe for another 2-3 years.


I.ve had an opportunity to create several software products, several
ebooks, and three home study courses: Butterfly Marketing, The 7 Figure
Code, and my coaching program, which was i5Gold, which was started in
May of 2006 and ends in December of 2007, which is two months from
the time of this call.

So I have 18 months of content which we.ve also wrapped into a home
study course that.s going to be put on CD-ROM and printed materials and
stuff like that as well.

So what we.re doing is when we get a lead, whether they buy a one-time
offer through one of our many sites, whether they buy an ebook or a
software product, or they buy Butterfly Marketing or The 7 Figure Code
or whatever the case is, once they come into our marketing funnel we have
a staff of two people that are in our call center.

They take those leads and they contact those leads. We also have a way of
extracting ClickBank leads, which I can tell you in a minute how we get
those people to actually get their telephone number, because ClickBank
doesn.t collect it. We want to make sure we can get those telephone
numbers the best way that we can.

Then we contact those people. I guess the page I can show you right now –
it doesn.t have it in retail prices because as you know, Russell, we like to
give the people in our call center the ability to build up the value of the
product and then hit them with a retail price, and as you said, your top-end
package will sell between $3,500 and $5,000.

Why? Because somebody may say to you, “Well, I just spent $497 with
you. That.s why you.re calling me,” or “I just bought Butterfly Marketing
at the retail price of $1,500 yesterday. That's why you.re calling me.”

So we give people an opportunity to be a little bit flexible in our pricing
plan as well. If you go to www.MikeVIP.com you can see a little page that
we made that has the offers that we sell.

So we made a little page for our guys, and we.re still working on it. Some
of the stuff with the workshop, the bullets aren.t in and they keep asking
me, “Mike, when are you going to write that in there?” and I promised
them I would get that done by Friday.

So when the leads come in, Russell, through any one of those sources that
I just mentioned there, the people in our call center will then give them a
call.
We like to call within 48 hours, because again we aren.t shipping out
anything in many cases. They.re usually digital products, and we.re
finding that certain products do better than others and we.re trying to see
where the strongest leads come in.

What we.re finding is that our sweet spot is for our middle package. The
top package sells for $5,000, the middle package sells for $1,497, and the
bottom package sells for $497. For the most part, most of our customers
go for the middle package.

Russell: Interesting. Now your call center is internal right now?
Mike: It.s internal, yeah. We have a 2750 square foot office, and November 1,
next week, we.re Suite E and we back up to Suite C. Suite C is 2800
square feet. It.s a total I think combined of 5,448 square feet and we.re
going to be knocking a hole right through where my office is, because
that.s the only adjoining part where these two suites meet, and we.re
going to double our size.

Just by January 1 we.re looking to go to a call center of 4, but our main
goal right now is to focus on HyperJava and growing our call center. We
feel that we have, like you do, we have the right type of offer that we can
work with people.

There are so many marketers, Russell, that have never heard any
information like we.re giving on this call. I.m sure it.s going to change a
lot of lives, but for the most part there are a lot of people out there selling
ClickBank products making $15,000 - $30,000 a month and they.re really
happy with that and they don.t have any back end.


Guys like you and I can come along and say, “Hey, let me put an offer on
your thank-you page,” and you know how it works. Somebody does a
launch. You.ve done 9,000. That.s incredible. That probably won.t

happen again for another couple years, and I don.t know that it.s ever
happened before.
But somebody can do a launch like Harris Fellman and do 3,500 – 4,000
products in 10 days, or even 2,000 products.

If you take the average launch like that, and there.s going to be one or two
of those a month, and then three other what I could call B-tier launches,
we can easily get our offer in front of 4,000-5,000 people a month.

If we take a 10% conversion rate on our upsells, or 8%, we.re going to be
looking somewhere in the neighborhood of 400-500 leads per month, real
quality leads. These people are paying $47-97, so these are real quality
leads.

So what we.re looking to do is just really build out from the piggybacking
effect, or the parasite effect if you will, which some people refer to in
marketing, where you.re piggybacking off of other people.s customers
right at the right time.

They just made a payment, they.ve got their wallet out and they see
another offer. We make it a no-brainer offer. We make it like “Wow!”
One of the things that we can do, Russell, with HyperJava is I can put a
timer on there to expire in 1 hour, 24 hours, 48 hours, 7 days, whatever the
case, from the time that they go there, and we can have a countdown timer
on the ad.

So when they get to the thank-you page it.ll say “23 hours, 14 minutes, 13
seconds…12 seconds….this offer will expire.” Once it hits 0 that offer
goes away forever. So that allows us to put real ridiculous offers out there
to get people.

As you know, countdown timers really will increase your conversion, and
HyperJava has that technology already built in as well, and we change that
at any time as well right from our admin panel because it.s an embedded
JavaScript code that goes on those pages, so it.s dynamic. We can change
the offers at any time if we find a better offer or we find out that 4 days
works better than 2 days, so just a side note.

What we.re looking to do is grow our call center to 4 people by January
and then go from there and hopefully get up to 6-8 people come March of
next year.

Russell: Now do you pay your call guys a percentage or are you paying a salary
also?

Mike: Right now it.s zero salary. I.m probably overpaying, but I do pay them a
percentage of the net cost. Would you like to know what I pay them?

Russell: Sure.

Mike: 20%. I've spoken with a couple people and they.ve told me, “Wow, why
so much?” so it kind of made me realize maybe I'm overpaying.

Russell: We do a lot of stuff with call centers, and I know you.ve worked with
some other call centers too, but we have real estate leads and we get like
30% of that. My call center, like I said I.ve got other guys that run the
whole thing. They recruit, they train, they fire, they.re both from call
center backgrounds. They do everything.

Between them managing the thing and the callers and everything, they get
65% of everything and I get 35%.

Mike: Yeah, the call centers that I outsource to, I only get 25-30% from them.
They keep 70-75%, so that.s why we wanted to go inhouse. Right now
I.m keeping 80%. I can give 10-20% to the JV partner and I can still make
60-70%.

We were turning our leads over to a call center, a pretty reputable call
center, in Las Vegas. But you know, Russell, you can go and you can meet
the owners of a call center and it.s like talking to you or talking to me.

They have our best interest at heart, but you know they hire people and
they train them and it.s like the car business. I know. There.s going to be
jerk salespeople that work their way in because businesses grow and we
need somebody at that desk. This guy quit. Let.s put this guy in here. He
used to work at this call center.

And the next thing you know he's telling somebody, “You.re never going
to succeed if you don.t buy this product.”
“Wow, I'm surprised you would talk to me like that.”
“Yeah, well I mean if you.re serious then you better buy it because I don.t
have time to waste with you.”

And all of a sudden you start getting these things at your help desk. “Mike,
this guy called. He said he was representing your company.”

And you're like, “Guys, I warned you about this. You're absolutely fired.
No exceptions. I told you keep these guys away from my customers.
You're ruining my reputation. Good bye.”

So we felt that going inhouse and monitoring it – I'm sure, Russell, you
have similar situations like that, and it.s going to happen in your call
center and it.s going to happen in mine.

People are going to say, “I'm not happy with the way I was treated.”
That.s the same kind of attitude, Russell, that we say if your refund rate
isn.t at a certain percent you.re not marketing hard enough.

If I never heard a complaint in three years about somebody in my call
center, then I could obviously say that they.re not marketing hard enough.
I mean there has to be a certain point where once or twice a month we.re
going to hear “This guy pressured me a little bit” because there.s a fine
line there with trying to help people and somebody.s thinking that maybe
they were pressured.

If that.s the case, we make it up to them. If they paid and they want their
money back they always get it back.

Russell: That.s interesting. I like your model. Initially we started with paying our
callers about 30-35% and at that point I was doing too much management
fulfillment, so these guys took it over and they built out the coaching
program and they run it all.

But I agree with having it internal because then you can monitor what
they.re saying. If someone curses one of my customers I can get on the
elevator and go upstairs and I can yell at the person right there, as opposed
to yelling at them on the phone. [laughing]

Ok, next question – Right now currently as far as this year, where has the
bulk of your money been earned?

Mike: So far this year?

Russell: Yeah.
Mike: Right now PayDotCom is just literally on fire. I mean yesterday we had
783 new sign-ups.

Russell: Is that sign-ups or transactions?

Mike: No, that.s new affiliates and vendors joining the system.

Russell: Really, wow.

Mike: Yeah, that site is growing at the rate of about 18,000-20,000 members per
month, either affiliates or vendors. If you look at Alexa.com, the site was
slow for a year and a half and we found out that we had a bug that we
couldn't find. It had to do with our SSL certificate and there was a crunch
that was going through every single time a page loaded and PayDotCom
was deathly slow to use. Even I hated it.

We upgraded our servers and always felt we would find the solution.
When we finally found the solution to make it quicker, if you go to
Alexa.com and you put in PayDotCom.com you see that in December of
2006 the second we turned on the site people fell in love with it and it.s
just taken off completely from there.

So PayDotCom is one of our silent killers. It.s doing now close to
$60,000-65,000 a month in revenue.

Our Butterfly Marketing sites, ListDotCom, InstantBuzz, ResourceReport,
FreeAdvertisingBlog – all those sites generate about $2,000 per day in net
profits, so that.s about $60,000 per month from all those sites combined.
Then we have upsells coming from integration marketing, I would say
HyperJava 1.0 basically, where we.re just asking people to take an offer,
put it on your thank-you pages, so that was bringing in about $50,000 per
month because we upsell those people to Butterfly Marketing.

Now that we have 7 Figure Code we can craft better offers, create more enticing
offers, and create more value.
We have JobCrusher, which is new. That brings in somewhere in the
neighborhood of – well, you know Russell, I don.t know that it.s fair that I
say how much it brings in and what percentages I get and my partners get.
Let me just put it this way – I probably get somewhere around $30,000 per
month from that.

Speaking this year brought in about $800,000 this year. Certainly we
brought in gross revenue of about $1.6 million for The 7 Figure Code.
So all tallied up, if we.re not doing a big launch or anything like that, our
revenue is somewhere in the neighborhood of about $400,000 per month if
there's no big launch going on, and this is with two or three launches per
year, either a ViralFriendGenerator or a big 7 Figure Code launch.

But we're not going to be pushing as many of those in the coming year.
We.re really focusing on working our marketing funnel through our call
center and things like that, but we.re not quite as strong as you are,

Russell, in offline advertising. That.s an opportunity for us to grow and we
learned a lot of good stuff from you on this call.
Russell: Awesome. The next one is, and you.ve talked a little bit about it, but
upcoming next year and the year beyond, where do you think your ship is
going to be moored?

Is it more in the call center back-end type stuff, more building out
PayDotCom, or where do you think your future – especially since you.re
retiring from public speaking, where do you think the future bulk of your
money.s going to be coming from?

Mike: I feel if I didn.t speak this year I probably could have made another $2-3
million in my business, and it brought in $800,000 to about $1 million in
income. But I think that the speaking allowed me to create a brand and get
out there that allows me to leverage what I have now, so I don.t know that
I would have been able to do it necessarily without speaking the last three
years.

So what I.m looking at for 2008, Mark Braunstein and I have partnered up
to do Vtribes.

Let me put it to you this way, we.re looking by the end of 2008 to have
2,500 customers where about 800 of them will be paying $97/month and
the other 1,700 will be paying $197/month for our technology, so that.s
going to be a pretty significant source of revenue there.

JobCrusher is a major focus of mine for the long term, starting with 2008,
and HyperJava.

And I have a very very big project coming out with Ellie and Charlie
Drake. We.re bringing internet marketing to multilevel marketing and
we.re going to actually build websites for people and they.ll pay for the
hosting, where they capture the leads and they call them so they don.t
have to pay $15/lead.

That.s going to be a launch that I.m working on with them for 2008 and
we.re looking to put about 6,000 people in that, that.s our forecast, paying
$39/month in the first year with that.

It sounds like big numbers. I don.t know that it can happen. They.re
telling me how much the MLM industry is really waiting for internet
marketing to come, and they.re speaking with all the big companies.

We.re setting it up in a way that all the big companies are going to be
referring to us and not be scared of us, because we.re not building
downlines, we.re not paying people to use it, we.re just providing value.
So we.ve got some pretty high hopes there, so that.s some of the stuff that
we.re going to be doing in 2008.

Just a quick recap –

. Vtribes
. JobCrusher
. HyperJava
. The project with Charlie and Ellie Drake

Russell: Awesome. The next thing, and this is something I heard you talk about it
might have been about two years ago and I don.t know if you.re still
pursuing it or not, but I remember you talked initially about taking the
Butterfly Marketing brand and kind of taking it to other niches and things
like that.

Is that still in the forecast, or what.s your plans with that, with your brand
there?

Mike: No, that is not in the forecast. I had gotten advice from some people to
take that brand and make Butterfly Marketing for Copywriting, Butterfly
Marketing for SEO, get together with Jeff Johnson and do a JV course, get
together with Perry Marshall and do an Adwords course, get together with
John Carlton and do a copywriting course.

But it.s just not in the cards, Russell. I.m sure you know more than
anybody that opportunities present themselves so quickly that 18 months
ago you were probably flattered – in fact, you and I were involved in a
situation like that together. We were asked to be part of an opportunity,
and then I think that was where you and I both learned that we have to flex
our own. muscle.

It's great to be honored, to great to be asked, but I have a vision and this is
going to distract me, regardless of the amount of money. I mean you and I
were promised a potential of $100 million to get involved with this, but
basically we would have had to walk away from our companies.

Then there's the small ones where people say, “Hey, I've got this project.
I.d like to give you 50% ownership in it,” and you're like, “Wow, that'd
be great. I'd love to have that technology,” and then you're like, “Why did
I ever say yes to this person? I'm letting them down because I just don't
have the time to commit to it.”

So I've learned now just to say no. No to teleseminars – very good friends
of mine just yesterday – they.re coming out with a newsletter and they
asked me to write and I just came up with three sentences:

"No, I'm sorry. I don't have the time. It was pleasure to be asked."
I was getting to the point where I was letting people down.

Russell: Yeah. It makes me laugh too when I see people and they're like, “There's
no opportunities out there.”

It's like let me throw 1,000 at you each day that I catch running by.
You're right, it's hard to say no sometimes, especially with the one we
would have been involved with would have been very lucrative.

I remember in The 7 Figure Code you talk a lot about this, your hedgehog
concept. This is something that in our company we've been trying to
really really focus on.

. What's our hedgehog concept?
. Where are we at now?
. Where will we be a year from now?
. Where will we be five years from now?

Anything else that comes in that pulls us away from that, no matter how
exciting, how sexy, or how lucrative it might be, and it.s hard when we
keep having to say no to them, it.s really difficult.

But if something does go with your hedgehog concept, it.s exactly where
you.re going and it.s a good complement or something, then it.s easy to
plug it right in.

But it.s great for everybody to establish that ahead of time so that you can
make decisions not based on money or greed, but based on what.s the best
for your customers and your employees and that type of thing.

Now are you ever planning on doing stuff locally by taking your business
offline and going more into local businesses or not? I.m asking this
selfishly because that.s one of my goals for next year, so I.m curious if
you.ve thought about that or if you.re doing anything related to that.

Mike: No. Russell, I.ve got to tell you, there.s a couple of projects that I'm going
into right now. I don't like to sound like a spoiled brat. I was talking with
Tom about this. I don't like to sound like a spoiled brat and stomp my feet
and say, “I.m going to do it this way. If I can.t do it this way it.s not going
to happen.”

But I'm going to do it this way, and if it's not going to be that way it's not
going to happen.

My motto is “Life is good. Don.t mess it up for more money.”

Russell, do you want more money? Sure, you can do more things in this
world with more money. You can help more people, you can provide more
value.

But would you double your business right now if you were to become a
slave to it and wake up one day and you.re working 7 days a week, you.re
working 16 or 18 hours a day, and you wake up and you haven.t had a
vacation in two years and you say to yourself, “Why did I ever go in that
direction for more money? Life was so good with half the money. I had
everything I wanted anyway.”

Health is the most important thing, your health and that of your family, so
I get into fights with some people – family, friends, JV partners, and stuff
like that all the time – where they say, “Why? Why won.t you do that?”
And I say, “Because it.s going to complicate things,” and it has to do with
that hedgehog concept that you were talking about, the thing that you can
be the best in the world at.

. Do you understand the metrics?
. What.s the core metric in this marketplace and do you understand
it?
. Are you passionate about it?

Once all three of those things line up…
In The 7 Figure Code I spoke about F.A.S.T. profits –
F It has to be fun
A It has to be automated
S It has to be scalable
T Time off

If a project isn't fun, if I can't automate it completely – literally, that it can
completely run without me, it's just a total goal, obviously it never will –
but if I can look at it and say, “How can I make this run completely
without me?” which is pretty much like PayDotCom or InstantBuzz. I do
not have to be involved in those sites.

Does it scale? If we go from 1,000 to 100,000 members will it affect the
site? Will I have to get a phone call? No.
And does it give me time for time off, because that.s the most important
thing is to take time off and spend it with your family, friends, and travel
and things like that, or whatever it is that.s important to you.

That.s become my filter. If it doesn.t qualify for those four things, I.ve
said no. I know people have looked at me like I.m a spoiled brat
sometimes, like “Why won.t you get involved with this? It meets this, it
meets this,” and I'm like “Because I don't want to be involved where I
have to be somewhere every Wednesday or whatever.”

That.s one of the reasons why with my coaching program, I announced in
December of last year that it.s going to end in December of this year
because I don't like to have to be on a schedule where every Wednesday I
have to provide content and I have to be somewhere at 5:00 p.m. Eastern
time.

So I've taken that content and I.m going to put it into a course, but I.d
rather not be fixed into any type of schedule. Sometimes some of the
partnerships that I.m asked to be involved in are going to require those
types of commitments, and regardless – I don't care if it would make $20
million a year – I'll say no to it because life is good and I don.t want to
mess it up. I don.t ever want to be saying, “Oh man, this guy calls me
every single day!” I just don't want to get involved in that.

So to answer that question, to do offline, I don.t think like you.re saying
doing local stuff in the area like local consulting or something like that?
Russell: Well, I don.t know how familiar you are with the Glazer-Kennedy model.

We follow theirs pretty much to the T, but one of their back-ends is they
sell area exclusivity to the Glazer-Kennedy name, so there.s actually a
local Dan Kennedy chapter here in Boise that meets.

The guy who runs it paid $50,000 to be the head of Boise and he goes out
and markets to all the businesses in Boise, brings them in, and they do
workshops once a month where he sells products and gets them to come to
seminars and runs everything.

So we're going to be selling DotComSecrets almost like a franchise where
you can buy a franchise and then you have rights to market in your local
area. You can put on seminars, you can put on workshops, you sell our
products, you bring people back to our national workshops and seminars,
where they're the ones doing it at the local level.



One thing nice about it we found is that people running a local business,
none of them know how to generate leads online so it.s very easy to teach
that and they generally have more money to invest in the back-end
coaching and product-done-for you type stuff.

I agree. I'm not putting my neck out there where I'm doing stuff locally,
but selling the franchise where these people can go out and basically buy a
DotComSecrets franchise and be able to market locally and have a local
ground force of people who are bringing leads back to us.

Mike: That sounds interesting. I.d love to hear your success with that. Keep me
informed. Glazer's just a genius. Dan Kennedy's a genius and you're a big
student of theirs and it shows.

So I'd love to see how that opens up for you and learn more from you
about that, as I always do.

Russell: When I first heard about it I was the same way. I was like, “I.m never
going to touch that,” and then I went to the local one here in Boise and the
guy's got 70-80 local businesses there and he.s preaching Dan Kennedy
and these guys are buying every product and everything. They're going to
all the seminars.

It's like man, you've got a team of people out there creating fans at a
different level than you can online. So anyway, that sounds interesting.
Ok, the next thing, we.ve got like 5 more minutes. I.m going to go
through the last two or three questions real quick.

The next one is are you planning on moving to other media, like to maybe
TV, magazines, mail, writing a book, or those type of things. Do you have
plans soon to do that? Are you going to be doing any of those?

Mike: Yeah, I.m looking to write a book in 2008. I don.t know what it.s going to
be on. I just want to meditate on that, Russell. I don.t know if it.s going to
be on entrepreneurship, on my story – I don.t think it.s going to be on
internet marketing. I think it.s going to be more on entrepreneurship, but I
just don.t know. It.ll definitely happen in 2008.

I don.t want to write a book just to write a book. I want to talk to some
people that I know like Frank Rumbauskas and Jeffrey Gitomer, where
these books completely transformed their career in terms of credibility and
press.

And yes, we're definitely looking into infomercials. We're redesigning
our corporate structure – LLCs and different companies, asset protection,
and all that type of stuff. I think you know what I.m talking about, right?
I know that you open up a whole different beast when you go online. In
other words you.re now on the radar. You.re now instantly – “Is this guy
another Don so-and-so?”

I want to make sure, Russell, that all of our books are in order, all of our
websites are in order, all of our Terms of Service, everything like that – I
don.t want to be a target for the FTC or anything like that for any mistakes
that I might have had with a disclaimer on a website or something that can
be found, but we definitely want to make sure that we get all that stuff
cleaned up and our companies are protected, our homes are protected, our
cars are protected, and our money.s protected, and everything like that.

We will be going hopefully to infomercials. I would think that.s probably
more of a 2009 thing, but it.s definitely something that I've considered for
probably the last couple years.

I can definitely see myself doing something along those lines, but I think
we have to be a little bit bigger, have a bigger game plan for the marketing
plan for massive leads and stuff like that, so it.s not something that I.ve
designed right now that I.m going to execute.

We looked at some companies like ITV Direct and we.re hoping to maybe
meet with them in New England and get to know some more about how
they could help us roll out an infomercial.

Russell: Well, you know I.ll cut my teeth on mine and see how it goes. I hadn.t
really thought too much about it. My dad does a lot of the asset protection
structure, we.ve done a lot of that We need to go back over our sites for
FTC compliance. I hadn.t really thought about that. That.s a great idea.
How about like magazines, direct mail, things like that – are you guys
doing those or going to be doing any of that kind of stuff?

Mike: Yes, I will definitely tell you that within the first quarter of 2008 we.re
going to be probably taking our business in the steps that you did a year
and a half ago.

We'll be first experimenting with direct mail offers to our list and we.ll
certainly be considering doing some type of free DVD offer.

I wanted to go kind of like through the back door. We already have like 40
leads a day that come in just from sales of our own products, our software,
ebooks, home study courses, and one-time offers. Those prices go from
$47 to $97 to $197 to $497, up to $1597.

I figured let me start my call center with my own leads, and then with the
HyperJava we.re starting leads, and then once we have the call center
down and we know our metrics, we know what to test and we know what
works better, then we.re going to go very soon into a free DVD type of
offer.

I appreciate you being so candid with your business there for everyone and
myself on the call, and for the advice that you gave. I.ll probably be
modeling you and Matt Bacak and guys that do stuff like that, just to bring
in more leads.

Certainly the $6.95 lead won.t be as good, or I don.t know. You.re doing
1 to 8. That.s really good. That.s about what we.re doing on our $47
product for our products, so either we have some room for improvement
on our call center, or maybe it.s just a different type of offer that works
well with the DVD, but we definitely want to explore it.

As far as direct mail, probably experimenting more. We've done a couple,
we.ve had success with it, but it was just “Hey, let's write this letter and
try to drive traffic to this website,” and stuff like that. I really want to, as
you said, turn it more into a business and not just selling products, so
we.ve got to map out a nice business plan for it.

Russell: Awesome. My next question is – and I know we.ve talked a little about
this – my long-term goal isn't DotComSecrets. My bigger business that I
want to build out is a site called BodyEvolution.com. That.s kind of my
big 2009 project.

Is this your long-term business? Do you have anything else under the
cooker? Are there different niches or industries that you.re looking at or
planning on doing at all?

Mike: In the short term, 2-4 years, I.m going to be very very candid and very
very up front with you. I.m very very proud of what I do and I truly love
the internet marketing industry.

I don't necessarily feel the need to go out and conquer other niches in
information products, so I will definitely try to stay out on the forefront in
being a leader in internet marketing, on the cutting edge and stuff like that.
When I check my “How did you hear about us?” for our products and I
hear something like, “You.re everywhere,” that to me is my goal, just to
be everywhere.

If I can be on thank-you pages and I can be on leads and you can have
people talking about you and your content is just out there – to me it.s the
biggest compliment.

“How did you hear about us?”
“You're everywhere.”
That.s my goal is to be everywhere and just provide value. I don.t need
everyone to love me. I certainly want everyone to love me, but I think all
you can do is like you said, Russell. Focus on providing value and I like to
be myself. I like to tell stories, and when I say stories I mean the truthful
stories of my life.

I like to let other people live through my experiences and have this
relationship with the marketers on my list. I like to let them see me, hear
me, touch me, video me – video.s going to be a big part of my marketing
next year. We have a production studio like you do. I love video. I love
connecting with members.

So I.m just excited to stay in internet marketing for awhile. Where the big
picture is, Russell, is I hope that one day I can create a technology. My big
goal would be, ok, I.ve got enough money right now where I could hire 9
different programmers and a structural engineer programming Ph.D.
genius that used to work for Nextel or Google or 37Signals or something
like that, that comes in and would help me bring a vision into the internet,
somewhere in the market of a Digg or a Technorati or – not a Google, but
certainly something that Google or MSN or Yahoo would turn around and
say “Wow, that.s a great company.”

Not to just get bought out for the sake of getting bought out and making
$100 million or something like that, but really creating something that.s
innovative, that changes the paradigm a little bit of things that go on.

I.m such a big fan of web 2.0. I don.t think it.s an overused term. When
you go to Wikipedia and you start studying what web 2.0 is and you start
clicking on every single link in Wikipedia and you start understanding
what the web is really going to and what social marketing really is all
about, I think that.s the future of the internet.

I think video is a big part of it and somewhere around there, Russell, I
think within 4-5 years I.ll be working on something so big. I have no idea
what that is, no idea at all, but that.s my goal, that.s my vision, is to just to
really crush it with something like that.

Russell: That.s awesome. I guess the last question then, we.ve kind of touched on a
couple things about the long-term, 10+ years plus, like retirement – what.s
Mike Filsaime.s long-term?

When you die and it.s on your gravestone, what is it that you want to be
remembered for? What is it the end goal that you.re trying to reach, if
that.s the question.

Mike: My dad quotes I believe it.s Steven Covey, and if it.s not I apologize. The
goal of everyone should be to live, to love, to learn, and to leave a legacy.
I certainly want to live life. I want to love my family, my kids, my
brothers, my sisters, my mother, my friends, and people I don.t know.

I want to continue to learn. I want to be a student for the rest of my life. I
just enjoy it. I mean I.ve enjoyed this call and we.ve got another hour to
go to let them drill us.

And then to leave a legacy. There.s that expression, on your tombstone
there.s the day you were born, there.s the day you died, and there.s a dash.
The dash is what really matters. What happened in that dash?

I think if you can leave a legacy, not trying to sound too corny or anything
like that, but the biggest thing, Russell, that you can do I feel is to really
give back.

You know the feeling you have when you help a deserving person that
comes to your help desk and you provide them with a discount or a course
or whatever, and months later they tell you about their success and you
really well up and you.re like, “Wow! That.s just awesome.”

I was watching what I thought would be a very corny movie, but I turned
out to like it. It was a movie called Evan Almighty. It was a sequel to Brue
Almighty.

Here.s this guy, Evan, that was a newscaster who became a congressman.
He wanted to change the world and be careful what you ask for. God says
to him, “So I.ve chosen you,” and he says, “But how am I supposed to
change the world? What am I supposed to do? I.m only one person.”

And Morgan Freeman, the character playing God, says, “You can change
the world with one act of random kindness at a time.”
I watched that on a plane and I was just like, “Wow, that is so beautiful.
One act of random kindness at a time.”

I was going through Sydney, Australia and I was seeing people on the
street that were just down and out, just mangy, and saying, “Hey, can you
spare some extra money?”

And instead of giving $1 maybe I gave $5-10 or whatever the case was.
People were saying, “They're just going to use that for drugs,” and I said,
“Well, sooner or later they're going to have to eat, so hopefully I.ve
provided there.” Man, it was just a great feeling.

Getting off the plane there was a lady that was struggling with a suitcase
and, I.m telling you, normally I.m in my own little world and they.ll get
their suitcase, but I reached out and I said, “Let me get that for you,” and I
got it out.

She just looked me right in the eye and said, “Thank you very much!” so
that kind of opened my eyes.

So what we.re doing for Thanksgiving this year – and I.ll wrap this up and
if we.ve got to go a little bit over for the next hour we can do that – but for
Thanksgiving when we went to Unleash the Power Within with Tony
Robbins, he spoke about what they do every Thanksgiving.

So we got a commitment, Russell, from every single one of my employees
to work on Thanksgiving up until about 2:00. We.re going to help in one
of those houses that provides food, serves food for the people that aren.t
fortunate enough to have anything to be thankful for that are at this present
time a little bit down and out.

We.re going to donate turkeys and stuffing and food and the whole staff
has just rallied behind this thing and they.re looking forward to it. I tell
you, we.re excited to have a Thanksgiving like that because I think that.s
the best fun you can have, is giving back.

When you.ve been blessed like many of us on this call have been, we all
have something to be so thankful for, to be able to give back I think is just
such a better feeling than getting.

So that.s a little long-winded answer here, but I wanted to say that.
Russell: It goes back to the whole thing we.ve talked about this whole call, the
main goal of business of any type is to provide value. If you truly provide
value, when you die if you.ve been making money no one.s going to
remember, “Oh, he made a bunch of money.” They.re going to remember
what you provided.

If you die and they're like, “That guy helped me with my business. That
guy helped me with my health. That guy helped me with…” – whatever
your niche or your business is, that.s what really counts.

You don.t take the money with you, you just take the value you provided
and what you did for other people, so that.s awesome.

Mike: Yeah, I.ve got a big heart, some people can say „to a fault.. A lot of people
say, “Mike, you.re too nice. You let people take advantage of you, man.”
I say, “Hey, it.s got me here so it.s seemed to be a good formula so far.” I
just believe when you give it comes back to you in a blessing ten-fold.

Russell: Ok, last thing. Do you have anything else that you want to wrap up with
before we open up for Q&A?

Mike: No, I think that was a great wrap-up. What we.re going to do, guys, our
clock says we.ve got 45 minutes but we.ll give a full hour here if needed.
So here.s what you do. You.ve heard Russell open up his business, just
really great stuff. I mean legal pad out, I.m writing stuff down, stealing all
of his metrics and everything like that, and you guys were doing the same
thing, and then we did it the other way around.

Hour 3 is now that you.ve got all this information, there were some
questions that I even had for Russell that I just didn.t get to get in, and I.m
sure you guys had a lot of questions that you were like, “I.d love to know
a little bit more about this.”

Whatever the question is, keep it on topic, but we.ll take your questions on
topic. Here's what you do – if you.re on the AccuConference line, that
means if you dialed into the number that starts with 404-920-6486, what
you can do is press *1 right now on your phone and you.ll go into a queue.

I'm going to take a look in the AccuConference right now. We have 11
questions rolling up. I.m going to take the first question. It will announce
that your line has now been unmuted and we.ll take your question.
So just state your name and where you.re from and who the question is
geared for and we.ll answer your question. We.ll take that first question
now. Go ahead, you.re live.

Caller: Holy cow, I.m first?

Mike: You.re first!

Caller: Wow, that's cool. Hey Mike, love you man. You guys are great. I've got
to ask you one question. It.s not even a question, it's kind of a statement at
first. You guys are doing something right here. You're laying the
foundation for what the ultimate product is going to be. I.m going to ask
you one question. What is the product?

Mike: Now are you saying the product that.s coming out of this recording? Is
that what you.re saying?

Caller: Is the means to the ultimate product. You guys are laying the foundation.
Everybody that is living their lives right now wants to know, “How can I
get out to the world my message, what I really do want.”

What is it that people want? You.re seeing that and you.re providing
people with a tool, right? What is the product?
Mike: In a general term, what we understand is that a product that.s going to be
successful is a product that fills a need, solves a problem, cures an ailment,
relieves pain, provides information – it could be humor, entertainment,
whatever the case is. There.s many many different niches.

How to make money, how to save money – that.s your classic information
product. The real real question you want to ask at first is not what is a hot
product that.s selling? It.s really what value can I provide?
What is my expertise? What is my passion? What is it that I know that I
can share, that I can put this energy out in the universe and just enjoy what
I.m doing and help people by providing value?

Really dig in and find out what that is. It.s different for everyone. I
wouldn.t necessarily tell you to chase an opportunity because the market.s
there. I would rather you find a market where your passions are.

Russell, any comments on that before we go to our next question?

Russell: It comes back to what we.ve been talking about the whole call, providing
value and doing it in a unique way that.s going to make someone want to
follow you and to listen to you versus everybody else that.s out there.

I.ve said a couple times that we.re going into the fitness industry, and
that.s probably the most saturated industry in the entire world. But I.ve
got a unique story, I.ve got a unique angle, I.ve got a unique twist and I
think I can provide a lot of value to that market that other people are
missing, and so that.s why I.m getting into that market.

I don.t even know what the product.s going to be yet, but I know I have
value to provide to that group of people and so I.m going to bring it to
them.

I promise you the money will follow because we.re setting up the
structure, just like we were talking about during this call, how to structure
things right and how to have things in place to provide the most value
possible for everybody.

Again it.s not a product, it.s the value. A lot of people come to our
workshops. They have an idea for this product. Ok, that.s good, but you
don.t make money with a product, you make money with a business. You
have different things that are going to provide more value and change
people's lives.

You need tools, you need resources, you need as much stuff as possible to
provide that value, and that.s where you make the real money and that.s
where you provide the most value and change the most people.s lives.

Caller: And here.s my point is that you guys are providing that foundation for
people to tap into a system, right? A system of what exactly they want.

Mike: There.s a big picture here that we.re trying to provide. Certainly that was
the goal of this call. Again back to Steven Covey, he says “Begin with the
end in mind,” so certainly everybody.s going to start with baby steps, but
as Russell just said, it.s about the business.

You have to look and think big. Providing value, you want to look at
“How can I do this in the form of a business?” rather than just product to
product, hit to hit.

We thank you for that question. We.re going to take our next question.
Thank you very much for your question. We appreciate it.

We've got 15 questions in the queue. That'll probably take us – Tom is
telling me that we're on the live web conference as well. You can put a
question in there if you're watching the streaming. We'll try to take a
couple questions from there and get through.

If you do have a question – we.re now up to 18 – press *1 now and we can
probably get to you, but we can.t promise. After that if you.re not pressing
*1 we won't be able to help you.
Ok, you.re live. State your name, where you.re from, and your question.

Caller: Good afternoon, gentlemen. This is Jim in Canada. I want to thank both of
you guys, Mike and Russell, for doing this. This has just been a fantastic
call. I really do appreciate it.

My question, Russell, is for you. While we.ve been sitting here listening
to you guys talk I did stop by DotComSecrets.com and on your blog you
mentioned something called a commission bump. Are you able to explain
that or maybe share a little bit of that with us?

Russell: Yeah, I can explain it real briefly. It goes back a lot to having your
business model correct. We talked about that in specific with Mike
Filsaime's promotion. We sold The 7 Figure Code. I got – was it $200 or
$250 commission, Mike, per person?

Mike: For 7 Figure Code it.s $225 I believe.

Russell: $225 commission, but after that we had a seminar, brought people to the
seminar, and at the seminar we also sold products to those people. Our call
center called people who bought through our affiliate link. We also are
creating a course out of that.

So within 30 days after we.d made the sale, our average value per
customer was over $600 just from the profits we made from those
customers at the seminar. Then they're going to the call center, they're
adding different things like that, so the value of each customer from that
sale probably by the end of the year should be over $1,000 per customer,
so that.s kind of what the commission bump is.

Again I would say that probably every single marketer that promoted
Mike's course, with the exception of maybe one or two, they made the
sale and that was the end of the transaction.

With us, we made the sale and then we provided more value by putting on
the seminar, then we provided more value by calling them and selling
them one-on-one coaching, then we provided more value by actually
packaging our seminar into a workbook and more and more.

So we take that initial sale and we don.t let it end there, and that.s how
you get the commission bump is you.re taking and providing more value
on top of that and making more money along the way.
Does that kind of make sense?

Caller: Great, absolutely. Thank you.

Mike: Yeah, and what's important there to understand here is these were
Russell's customers to begin with, or they were on his list, because they
were his customers that he took from his list, drove them to my product,
they bought so they could get his bonus, and then it was a siphon process.

He was able to find out some people on his list that were interested in
buying this and then he was able to move them through different products
in his funnel.

Just to be completely transparent, it.s the very same thing. The people that
are on this call were on my list that I promoted for Russell.s product, so
now they're Russell's customers and they're my customers, so I go into
Clickbank and I get the data.

I email you, you sign up in the forum, you give your phone number, and
then we get that data and you may be getting a call from us in the next
couple of days as well for our products, and that.s a commission bump.

So I started with a $24 commission and then we have an opportunity to
provide value for people with good offers from $497 up to $5,000, so
that.s a very very good question.

I'm going to put this caller on mute right now and I.m not going to take
the next question in the queue, but what I will do is Tom has someone
highlighted here. His name is Nick Martin from Copenhagen, Denmark.
The question is – Russell, I'll read it to you and maybe you could answer
it for us.

Caller: How do members who bought products at the initial price feel about all
the lower-cost bonus offers later on? How do people feel when they buy a
product at 100% and then 3-6 months later they see the product for free in
a bonus bundle or reduced more than 60%? Is this cheating those that
bought when the product was first launched?

Mike: You know, Russell, if you don.t mind I.ll answer that because I think that
may be geared towards what I was saying about bonus offers and
everything like that.

Here's the way the world works. Wal-Mart has blue light specials. Kmart
has specials. Supermarkets have red dot specials. Burlington Coat Factory
Sears, Macy's, Home Depot – they all have specials.

I remember I bought a Toshiba laptop for $2,997 and I remember when I
went back I said to somebody, “You.re getting a $3,000 laptop for second
place in Butterfly Marketing.”

I went to go buy it and it was $1,997 a month later and I said, “Is this the
same laptop? Where's the one that's $3,000?”
He said, “Oh no, that price went down.”

So we have to understand that specials come and go. You can buy
Kellogg's Corn Flakes today for $3.49 a box and then next Sunday it
could be 2 for $2.

So it's a very very good question. How do customers feel? I will try to
think this through before I say it and try to really think back over the last
couple years. I don.t know that I.ve ever had a customer do anything other
than ask.

I can honestly say I've never had a customer get upset. I've had a
customer a couple of times say, “Hey, I bought this but then I was at the
seminar and I saw that I could've gotten that and this for the same price.”
We'll say, “Ok, well, what I can do is I can offer you that for free,” or
whatever the case is. If there's ever a case where a customer asks, we try
to make them happy.

But customers understand that special offers come and go all the time.
That.s why I am a fan of making special offers expire or make them one-
time offers and use technology that makes the offer expire. I.m a big fan
of having a strong reason why.

For instance, there could be people that maybe bought a product of mine,
and I'll say “If you buy this $1,000 product, you get that product as a
bonus.”

A good thing to understand is marketers like that will always provide
opportunities for people to get special offers. People run 3-day sales, fire
sales, or whatever the case is. The most important thing is just to say to
yourself, when an opportunity comes your way is there enough value for
you to see where you could take advantage of it.

Russell: One thing I would add is that happened to me with the iPhone. I bought
the iPhone early and paid $600 for it, and then like two weeks later they
dropped it down to $400. I think they gave you like a $100 gift certificate,
but it was $200 lower.

At first I was kind of frustrated, but then I looked back and said, “You
know, I got a chance to have the iPhone for like two months before all
these people got this discount and there.s value to that.” Being the first

one to get your hands on a tool gives you increased value. You're the first
person that gets to use it.

Getting information before someone else, that.s worth a lot of money,
whereas if someone else hesitates and waits and three or four months later
goes and buys the same product and it.s a little bit cheaper, that person
now has had three months to benefit from that knowledge, and how much
more is that worth to him?

I've seen on the other hand now where we just raised the price on The 12
Month Internet Millionaire from $37 to $97. We get people on the help
desk all day saying, “Oh, it used to be $37. Can we get it for $37?”
We say, “No, we told everybody that.s the reason why you had to buy
early was because the price was going up.”

Russell: You don.t want to upset people, but when all is said and done…

Mike: And you make them happy. It.s easy to make people happy, especially in
the information business. Physical products are marked up sometimes 8-10
times and digital products are free. Make people happy, make customers
for life, and you.ll turn that situation into a diehard customer for life.

Excellent question there in the chat. We.re going to take our next question
now. We.ve got Scott Stenke from Oshkosh, Wisconsin.

Caller: Russell, if you were starting over today, what would three things would
you expedite in order to get you up to your current earnings in the quickest
amount of time, and what three things would you avoid like the plague?

Russell: This is a good question for me, just for the fact that we.re building now
with BodyEvolution. The first three things I would do is I would record a
CD with a very unique hook on it, like we.re doing with BodyEvolution
right now. That would be my front end.

I would have a print newsletter in place where I could have continuity, and
I would have a back end in place. Those are the three things. If I were
starting over that.s all I would do, and that.s what I.m doing in my other
market.

Free front-end product, continuity program, and back-end offer. That.s the
three things.

Three things I would avoid like the plague would probably be – I don.t
know the exact words, but not taking action, trying to learn and trying to
get everything perfect ahead of time.

I've got a big sign right here above my desk that says “Ready, fire, aim!”
that my wife made for me the first year after we got married.
That's kind of been my motto, not spending a lot of time aiming and
aiming and trying to learn everything and trying to get everything perfect
and getting your site perfect and getting everything perfect. That kills
almost everybody who wants to be successful, trying to get everything
perfect.

The biggest thing is moving fast, getting things out there, tweaking and
getting them better, but moving quickly is I think the biggest reason why
people struggle.

The other biggest sin to avoid like the plague is being boring. I.ve seen a
lot of great marketers, great products, great things, and they don.t sell
because they're boring.

You need a unique hook, unique angle, unique something that.s going to
get someone to want to buy from you versus everyone else.

The 12 Month Internet Millionaire had a pretty unique angle. That's why
we sold 9,000 copies. It had a unique angle, people wanted to hear about
it, it had a good story – that's what sells products, stories.

You look at any kind of good salesman, any kind of platform seller or
phone seller, anything like that – they have a good story they.re sharing to
get people enticed and sucked into the buying process.

So moving fast and getting a great story – those are the two really really
important things.
If you look at any of my products or any of Mike's products, they always
have some kind of story around them and that.s to get people to buy it, is
the story and how they can relate that story back to their business or their
life or their circumstances.

Mike: Way to go, Russell. I also want to just commend you and congratulate you
on your growth and your confidence when you.re talking on the line. I
happened to be on your very first teleseminar, which you yourself just say
that you weren.t ready to get on the telephone and do stuff like that.
Man, you.ve just come such a long way. You.re just the best.


We're going to take our next question. You.re now live. State your name,
where you're from, and your question please.

Caller: Hi, my name is Rob and I.m from Los Angeles, CA.

Mike: Hi Rob, how are you?

Caller: I.m good, thanks Mike. Hi Russell.

Russell: Hello.

Caller: My question is to both of you. I.m new to internet marketing, and the
element that I'm missing – and I know there's elance to find this – but I.m
looking for the software to make everything happen. Like when you click
on a link and you pay with PayPal, there's an automatic redirect and they
can download their pdf, I'm missing all those elements to figure out how
to automate this to get this all to happen.

Mike: Ok, here.s my answer to you. Go to www.The-Resource-Report.com. I
don.t know if you have that report. The promise on that page is I.m going
to show you every tool I use to run my online business. So when I start
using something, like that HighRise at 37Signals, or I use Basecamp to
manage my projects, I.ll tell you every single tool so you know every tool
that I.m currently using.

For the most part, I could tell you it.s going to be a B+ to A+ tool, because
we.ve tested out a lot of different things.
Now for the question that you had for PayPal, what I use to instantly
create a button to redirect to a product where I can make a thank-you page
or pdf, I use my own site, PayDotCom.com.

It's free to join. You log in, you click on „Create a product,. you say „This
is the name, this is the price, this is my sales page, this is my thank-you
page,. and you hit submit, and it gives you a button.

When people click on that button – you put your PayPal account obviously
in your profile – so they'll go to Paypal, they.ll pay you, and they.ll
redirect to any page that you let them know. It secures your download
page for you, so PayDotCom can do that for you.

Caller: Great, now does that work in conjunction with like Aweber when you.re
trying to collect the addresses and so forth? Does this all just work
together?

Mike: Well, what you do is you make your thank-you page a registration page.
Make it say "Thank you for your order". Please register your information
here so we can email you your product..

Then they give their name and their email address on the Aweber form
and I think you've learned from this call that you want to get their optional
(make it optional) or give them a free bonus if they give you their
complete postal address and best phone number.

Then when they hit submit you can email them the product and you can
also redirect that page on submit to the thank-you download page as well.
So yes, it can certainly work in your process with Aweber. Does that
answer your question?

Caller: It does. Thank you so much. I appreciate it.

Mike: You got it. Ok, Tom.s going to take our next question here.

Caller: My name.s Steven. I.m from Redmond, Washington. This question is for

Russell. You were talking about your coaching program and is there a
specific phone number you can call to sign up for that, or is there a
website that you can go to to get that information?

Russell: There is. Let me give you the phone number. You can call ---

Mike: You got the number to my office, Russell? Go ahead. [laughing]

Russell: [laughing] Area code 208-343-0995. Probably Garrett or Tash will answer
the phone. Just say you were on the call and you.d be interested in
learning more about our one-on-one coaching program and they can tell
you all the information.

Caller: I couldn.t quite hear the number.

Russell: It.s 208-343-0995.

Caller: Ok, thank you.

Mike: Very good. Tom's going to mute that line and then give me one from the
people who are listening to live streaming. This is Cheryl Gonzalez from
San Antonio, TX, where our good friends Armando Montelongo and
Veronica Montelongo from A&E.s “Flip This House” live.
She asks –

Caller: My phone died but I was queued in for a question. I would like to ask
about DVD and CD fulfillment. Where do you actually get DVDs and
CDs copied, and how much are they? How about the cover cost? What is
the average cost to put a CD or DVD together?

Mike: Russell?

Russell: If you go to www.IM-Myth.com, at the report at the very end we have a
resource section that shows the resources we use for our CD production
and fulfillment.

Basically there.s a couple companies in Kansas, and I.m sure Mike you
know TJ Rover is this big huge famous direct marketer and he was from
Kansas and he built up all these printing and fulfillment companies all
around where he lived because he was sending out so much direct mail.

Anyway there.s a company, I believe it.s like McMannis Printing. I think
that.s the company we use for our CDs, and then there.s Minute Maid or
Minute Man fulfillment and they actually ship the CDs out for us.

It.s relatively cheap. We.re paying under $1 per CD when we order them
and when we ship them out, depending on the quantity, but that.s who we
use.

Like I said, all those names and contact information and emails for our
point people at all those companies are all in The IM Myth and you can get
all those at www.IM-Myth.com for free.

Mike: And I use www.SpeakerFulfillmentServices.com and the other one that.s
highly recommended by people like Jeff Walker is www.Disk.com.

Russell: We.ve used them and they are very good too.

Mike: And what.s the other one? www.FulfillmentCentral.com I think are the
people that like John Di Lemme and Mike Litman use, so those are some
great resources for you.

To give you the average cost, you could create a 10-DVD or 12-DVD
course or CD course with a simple wrapper and it.ll cost you $15.
The 7 Figure Code, if we didn't include the printing, probably would have
cost about $30-40 to produce. When we added the printing we weren't
prepared for the price of it. It shot our costs up to about $90 per unit
because of the massive binders that we put in there.

So believe it or not when you take that initial $497 cost, the product cost
us about $100 to produce, $225 to pay the affiliate, and then in some cases
about $75 to ship international, we were making about $90-150 per sale
after our merchant fees in some cases.

Tom, we.ll take another question online. That was a very good question,

Cheryl. Thank you.

Caller: Hey Mike, it.s Roosevelt from Long Island, New York. A question for
you and Russell – I noticed something that you mentioned is something
that I'm working on right now. You mentioned about going into other
markets such as network marketing. I do some stuff for real estate, but for
going into other markets – and Russell mentioned he.s doing this as well –
and offering internet marketing strategies and techniques to help them
grow their business.

Do you think that that.s a market that someone starting out could come in
and build a business to the size that you guys have built, just strictly
focusing on helping people in those particular niche markets to use
internet marketing strategies and techniques to grow their business, and if
so what would be the best approach that you would probably take if you
were going ahead and doing that?

Mike: Russell I'll go first, ok? I was sitting at the World Internet Main Event
speaker dinner and I was sitting next to another speaker and John Childers.
One of the speakers said “I think we need to create a course for doctors
and lawyers and attorneys and dentists and plumbers, to teach them how to
make money online using like Google Adwords. It.s so powerful and they
just don.t know it.”

I looked at that person and I said, “I disagree 1,000%” and they said,
“Really? Why is that?” and I said, “Because doctors and lawyers and
plumbers and dentists and deli owners don.t want to know internet
marketing. They want more customers. They don.t want to know about
Google Adwords and watching videos. It.s not what they do. It.s not their
passion. Their passion is selling more bagels. It.s getting more clients. It.s
cleaning more carpets.”

These people will pay hand over fist for leads and for somebody to do it
for them. Case in point, in the car business. You cannot go to a general
manager or the owner of a dealership and say, “I'm going to give you a
Google Adwords course to show you how to use this product, localize the
keywords so that when somebody types in…” –
They're going to go, “How much can I pay you to do that? Oh my
goodness. You can get me these leads?”

That's why car dealers pay $15 per lead to CarFax, to Cars.com,
Edmonds.com, NADA.com, Gals.com, AutoTrader.com and all these
websites. They pay $15 per lead for these companies to do them for them
because the car dealer can take a $15 lead and make a $2500 back end
selling a car.

As far as like local markets, there.s a great opportunity for anyone on this
call if that would be their passion to learn how to create landing pages
specifically for lawyers, attorneys, doctors, auto dealers, whatever the case
is. Find out the keywords that people are bidding on, drive traffic to a
landing page, collect data, and sell that data for $15-20 per lead to these
websites, or charge them a maintenance fee of $1,000 per month.

You own the domain and you give them the leads for free as long as they
pay you $1,000 per month. You get 10 clients and you.re making $10,000
month. Guys, it can easily be done if you know what you.re doing and you
put a little bit of time and effort into that.

What ends up happening is since you own the domain,
GetChryslersForLessLongIsland.com, as soon as that dealer says, “I don.t
want to pay you anymore, or I want to pay you half the price,” you say,
“Ok, have a nice day. I.m going to go to the other Chrysler dealer who
will be more than happy to pay me $1,500 for these leads that I.ve gotten
for you on autopilot.”

So I think there.s a great opportunity for internet marketers to become an
expert in the local area and go out and help carpet cleaners, plumbers,
doctors, and lawyers optimize for words like „DWI attorney Suffolk
County. and things like that, or whatever the case is. I think there.s a great
market there.

I.m not sure if I answered exactly what your question was, so I.ll turn it
over to Russell. Maybe he interpreted your question a little bit differently
and can give you an answer on that as well.

Russell: I just want to add two things to what you said. I think what you said is
right. We found that especially people who have some kind of business or
industry, like network marketing, we.ve played in that industry and they
don.t want to learn how to build a list. They want someone to give them
leads.

In fact, in real estate, dentistry, we have clients in a lot of these different
markets and we.ve actually built out our whole done-for-you program
where we build your website, we generate leads, and charge them a
premium to do all that stuff.

Then the second thing is you were talking about creating sites for local
markets. One of my friends who used to be an employee, he.s doing this
now in Boise where he.s setting up these websites for tons of companies
like Boise Lawn Company and all these different companies. He.s
charging them like $3,000-4,000 to set up a landing page.

Then he does SEO stuff to all these pages. To get Boise Lawn Care on
page 1 of Google takes about 20 seconds. He uses these local keywords
and it.s so easy. He.s not charging like $15/lead or $1,000 per month.
He.s charging 50% of anything that.s made off that lead he wants. He.s
becoming their online partner and he.s doing real well with it.

These guys get 10-15 leads a week and he gives them to them. If they sell
something he gets half of the profit. That way he.s making money, they.re
making money, and he becomes the internet marketing arm of their
company.

Mike: And they love him.

Russell: Oh, they love him. Yeah, that.s a huge business. If I were starting over I
might play the local market game and just go to businesses like that.
Creating a landing page takes us what, 5 minutes? Find the four or five
keywords they want. Get them on page 1 and you split half the profits
from every lead generated. You do that for 10 companies a month and it
adds up really quick.

Mike: Yeah, absolutely. That goes to the article that I wrote two months ago
that.s on my blog at www.MikeFilsaime.com that was „Fish, Poles, Boxes
and Buttons.. People don't necessarily want the fish. They want it cooked
for them, they want it caught, they want it fried up and served with the
lemon, the butter, and the broccoli on the side.

The closer you get to giving the people the all-in-one package, the happier
they'll be and the more they.ll pay and the longer they.ll stay with you.
So thanks for the question there Roosevelt. We appreciate it. We're going
to go to our next question.

You're live. State your name, where you.re from, and your question.

Caller: This is Christopher from Atlanta. I have a couple questions. One is can
you guys put in a little small pdf of that question that somebody asked a
little while ago about what you guys use for pdf, for DVDs and CD
fulfillment stuff, because there.s a whole list of things there and it was
actual numbers and websites that you can contact.

Mike: When we produce this product, we.re having it transcribed for you into a
pdf, so you.ll get all that stuff within a week I would like to say. You'll
have that in the forum where you got the call information.
Your next question?

Caller: The other question had to do with the actual physical product that Russell
is shipping, the one that he went apeshit over that that he kind of read
three times over and his wife got mad at him.

Russell: We've shipped almost all of them. If you call my office they can look up
and see if yours has been shipped yet or not, but they.ve all been shipped
or by Saturday everything should be shipped out, so it has been already or
it will be very very soon.

Caller: How long would that be, do you think Russell?

Russell: We.re shipping through DHL so what.s that, usually 3-4 days?

Caller: I don.t know. I never use DHL.

Mike: Yeah, you can call his office and they'll mail that out for you.
We.re going to mute that line. We.re going to take a question from
someone online. This is Watt Batty from the U.K.

Caller: What's the best advice you would give to my newbies to get started in a
mail order continuity program business?

Mike: I think a lot of that information was probably covered in 12 Month
Internet Millionaire so I don't want to skirt on that question, but Russell
wouldn't you say that a lot of that information was already covered in 12
Month Millionaire?

Russell: Yeah, and we talked about that at the beginning of this call too when you
were questioning me about having the free report that you charge shipping
on. That's the best way to get into the mail order business, is generating a
lead online and then taking them offline.

If you were listening earlier in the call we talked a lot about the best way,
and that.s what I would recommend for your newbie customers.

Mike: Ok, we're going to go to Toronto from the live streaming webcast. This is
typed in from a person named Manu.

Caller: Hi guys, great job on the call, love it! My question is how can you sell
affiliate programs effectively, as well as get your own affiliates to sell the
products for you?

Mike: Russell, that.s your territory, man. How do you sell people on using your
affiliate program and selling your products for you?

Russell: That.s a great question. Getting affiliates to sell your product – there's a
couple types of affiliates out there. One type of affiliate is looking for
great-converting products with great copy where they know if they put $1
into pay per click they're getting $2 back out. We.re more and more
seeking out those type of affiliates because they.re more consistent and
more long-term.

But you have to have great offers that converts really really high and
usually pays out really high commissions.
The other types of affiliates are people like me who are more interested in
real unique exciting products that are going to change people.s lives. Most
of the things I promote, they.re not always the best commissions or
whatever, but I usually get products that I get excited about that have some
kind of angle or something different or exciting. That's what I'm always
looking for as an affiliate.

If you create a good product and you want people to promote it, send them
a copy. I get people shipping me packages all the time. It's interesting,
sometimes you.ll open a package and I'm like, “Huh, I have no idea what
this is” and I just push it aside.

Other times I open the package and I.m like, “Oh wow!” The other day
these guys were launching a how-to-make-software program. They sent
me this box and I opened it up and I got so excited by the product. I was
ripping it open, I was putting it in, I was watching and going through the
book.

I called them up and said, “Yes, I will promote. Whatever it is, this is
exciting. I got excited about it so I know other people will too.”
So make your product exciting. Have a unique angle that.s going to get
other affiliates excited about it. That.s how I promote, based on how
excited I am by the product.

I'm sure, Mike, you could add to that too, just the things that you.re
looking for normally as an affiliate.

Mike: Yeah, on the first part of that question, selling your affiliate program, the
first thing I would definitely say is put as much attention into your affiliate
program as you do into your sales page.

We spoke a lot about that in Butterfly Marketing. If you go
www.TheButterflyMarketingManuscript.com, scroll down to the bottom
of the page and click on „Affiliates earn money. or go to
www.ViralFriendGenerator.com/affiliates, you can see the effort that I put
into setting up my affiliate programs.

Russell, you know www.TheSecondTier.com was a sales letter to sell your
affiliate program as well.

I believe so much in this that I have a product coming out next month
called www.AffiliatePageDominator.com, which is basically going to sell
an affiliate page like the one that I use that will allow you to manage it and
have a tell-a-friend and all that stuff built in like all my pages do, a pre-
made template.

So I think it's important that when somebody joins your marketing funnel,
whether they buy a product or become a prospect, certainly for us it.s very
easy for us to tell a prospect to become an affiliate, but to show people not
only how they can benefit from your product, but also how they can make
money by helping to share the word of the product, and provide them with
a lot of different tools like I just showed you with the pages that we link
there.

I think people will stick with you when they make money. If you just say
"Sign up here" and they've got to jump through hoops to get into your
affiliate program, and all you did was provide them with a link, I can
promise you they're not going to stick around.

But when you provide tools for people and you show them videos on how
to create an Adwords campaign and you give them the keywords and you
write the blog review for them, you write the articles, you write the press
releases, you write the email copy, you make banners in all different sizes
and all that stuff, and you show them how to use it, you.re going to have
much more success.

Thank you very much for that question. We.re going to go to another
question live online.

Russell, we have about another 15 minutes. We'll be 10 minutes over, so
hopefully we can get about 4 more questions in.

You're live. State your name, where you.re from, and your question.

Caller: Hi, my name is Lionel. I'm from Arizona. My question is I am absolutely
brand new to this whole world of internet marketing and everything. I'm
just one of the greenest people that you'll ever meet. What would you
recommend in terms of getting started?

I have a lot of great ideas and I already have a product that I would love to
be able to launch and get out there, but I don.t even know the first step
that I would need to do.

I found you guys and I'm plugging in and learning as much as I can. But
what would you recommend?

Mike: Ok, the first thing I want you to do when you get off this call is go to
www.TheHistoryOfMikeFilsaime.com. What I want you to know is that
when that video starts you.ll know one thing. You know more about
internet marketing right now than Russell and I did when that video starts,
and that.s a fact.

When that video starts, it starts in 2002, when Russell and I didn't know
that internet marketing existed, and you do. So I think that video will
really inspire you because it.ll show you my entire story month by month,
and a recap at the end of every year of how I went through my business.

What I want you to just know simply is that breaking it down to its
simplest form is that any type of marketing really breaks down into two
things: traffic and conversion. When you generate traffic, you need a
website to convert it.

So the first thing I would tell you if you.re just starting out is don.t worry
about creating products just yet. Find products that are already out there
that are something that you.re passionate about in the marketplace.
If it.s sports, health and fitness, making money, how to play poker –
whatever it is – go to a site like ClickBank.com and search for whatever it
is that you're passionate about.

What you.re going to find is the search results are going to be listed with
the best-selling products in that category, with the best-selling up front and
then going down from there.

So start with the best-selling products. Why? Because they.re #1 for a
reason .They.ve already taken half of the equation out of it for you. They
have a product, they have a website, they have a help desk, it converts
well, and that.s why they.re #1. They.ll allow you to get a link to promote
their product as if it were yours and get 50% of the profits.

After you learn how to do that, you can go out and create your own
products that you can wrap your name around, that has your unique story
and your unique hook and your unique angle.

So what you want to start focusing on is how you can generate traffic.
When you can generate traffic, you own the keys to the castle. If you can
move traffic to any particular place you want, you can do anything you
want online as an affiliate, and then you can really ramp it up when you
start creating your own products.

So what I want you to focus on is finding something that you.re passionate
about, find someone else selling it, sign up for their affiliate program, and
start driving traffic to that website or to a pre-website that you put up
where you capture their name and email address and then later direct them
to that website.

Some of the good ways to get traffic certainly are using things like Google
Adwords. I would recommend that you get that into your marketing. Other
ways are using organic methods of creating it. It.s a bit slower but creating
content out on the web using blogs and using articles and things like that
to get traffic to those sites.

But certainly the best way to get started is with Google Adwords. Get a
good product on Google Adwords. There.s many of them out there that
can help you understand.

Russell, have you got any comments for him as well?

Russell: I agree with you. Initially find an affiliate product and start driving traffic,
but I think the biggest thing is you really need to start establishing and
branding your personality in the market.

Set up a blog and start blogging and start telling your story so people can
get to know you. The thing I found is the more people know about my life,
the more of my story I share with people, the more those people are
endeared to me. They're more likely to buy from me, to listen to me, to
open my emails.

So before you get a product going, set up a blog and start talking. Start
telling your story and start doing some of these traffic methods that Mike's
talking about to get people to want to hear from you and want to listen to
you, so when you start recommending products and services, they already
trust you, they like you, and they.re more willing to buy from you.

A big thing when I was getting started to get people to my site, I spent a
lot of time in forums. You can.t go and spam the forums. You can
contribute to the conversations there. You can post messages and usually
you can have signature files that give people more information about you
and send them to a website. It.s a great way to start getting people to your
site initially.

Bringing out the character of you is big in marketing, especially internet
marketing, because there.s so much noise, so many people competing, so
you want to put out your character and your personality.

That.s what people get attracted to and that.s why people will buy from
you and why they.ll read your emails, why they.ll open them, and why
they want to become customers.

So start focusing on that, find the right products, start recommending
them, and then build out your own products after that. That.s really kind
of the process.

Mike: Good point. Get YourName.com and make it a blog and take Russell.s
advice there.

Thanks for the question. We're going to go to another one on the
teleseminar line. We.re going to take that next question. Please state your
name, where you.re from, and your question.

Caller: This is Lynn from southern California. You guys are doing a super job.
Thank you so much.
My question is in regards to the continuity programs you.ve been talking
about. Could you share what your best source of content is? How do you
keep it up to date and ongoing?

Russell, you talked about a newsletter on a regular basis, and then
JobCrusher has ongoing content. How do you keep that information up to
date with so many resources out there? Which is your best?

Russell: I.d say for our company what we do obviously is I have each of our
employees write about what they.re writing about, but if you don.t have
employees you need to go out there and find people who are the experts
and interview them.

I.ve seen a lot of different CD-of-the-month type clubs that work really
well. In fact, we.re starting one probably in a couple months called
"Marketing in Your Car". All it is, that whole continuity program, is us
interviewing people and you get it on CD and you can listen to it in your
car.

We find who.s got the hot topic of the month or whoever it is, and so we
interview them and it makes it a really easy continuity program.
So those are kind of the ways we.re making sure our content is fresh. First
off it.s what we.re doing internally in our company, and secondly we're
going out and finding other experts and bringing them in and interviewing
them.

Mike: And for JobCrusher, that has a focus of getting people, especially newbies,
from 0 to $4,000 per month, but as far as the continuity that goes in there,
one of the important things when you.re a leader in any niche or any
market is to keep your ears to the ground and keep your eyes open with
hyper-awareness, not just like observing things that are in front of you, but
being conscious that you.re looking for something and then you can see
things a little bit easier.

Then what you want to do is you want to become a reporter for what is
cutting edge. People love to know what.s cutting edge. When you.re the
person that.s constantly giving things out, like for example the HighRise
thing over at 37Signals.com, if you.re constantly giving out that kind of
information, people love to be a part of it because they always get good
information from you.

It.s your job to decipher all the fluff, all the noise, go through a product,
go through a course, and give people the Cliff notes.

Tom and I here in my office, we subscribe to something called Executive
Book Summaries, where every month they give us 4-6 books or something
like that. They read through 20 books that just came out, find out the 12
that are junk, and they give us the 4-6 books that are really good and they
break it down into a CD that I can listen to in my car in 20 minutes, and
they break the book down into about 8 pages that I can read while I'm
eating my lunch, and then I feel like I.ve read the book.

So that's what people want. They want you to filter out the noise for them
and only provide value. They know that if you.re not talking about it then
it doesn.t need to be spoken about.

When you talk about what's good and you break it down into a digest, into
a Cliff's note version for people, create a little YouTube video to
summarize it, they.ll just fall in love with it because it.s always fresh, it's
cutting edge, and that's a great way for you to create continuity.

Does that help out?

Caller: Yes it does. Thank you very much.

Mike: Great, thank you. We have about 7 more minutes and we're going to take
a question from the live streaming webcast that was typed in. This
question is from Reverend Ted down in Florida. He asks –

Caller: Since I have met Mike before and spoken with him, my question was for
Russell. There seems to be a lot of mixed response with internet marketing
on the opinion about using advertising medium such as safelists, traffic
exchanges, and other ad exchanges, InstantBuzz, etc.

I get this question a lot from my own subscribers. The overall perception
is that this is surfing the bottom of the barrel. I know Mike uses safelists
etc. First, what is your response to this perception? For someone new with
no ad budget, what things should someone avoid and what works best
when using these types of advertising media?

Russell: That's interesting. I've had this conversation quite a few times and before
we talk about it I want to give you a concept that hopefully will make it all
make a lot of sense.

One of the things that.s powerful about the internet is the fact that people
congregate together based on similar beliefs, values, ideas, and things they
care about. I use the word congregate because it.s easy for people.s minds.
When you hear the word "congregation" you usually think of church, so all
the Baptists congregate together, the Mormons congregate together, the
Methodists congregate together.

So if you.re selling something to the Mormons, you go to the Mormon
church. If you.re selling something to the Catholics, you go to the
Catholics. It.s very simple.

What.s powerful about the internet is that people congregate together
online. They didn.t used to be able to do this. Ten years ago if you were
interested in potato guns there was one guy in Idaho besides me who
wants to talk about potato guns, but online you can go to SpudTech.com
there's a forum of like 6900 people talking about potato guns. So it.s very
easy for me to find a congregation of people in my target market who I
can go and I can market to.

Every niche, everything we go into and we teach our students it.s “Ok,
what is it you.re selling?”
“I.m selling how to teach my dog how to talk.”

“So the people that you.re selling to, your target market, are people with
dogs. Where do people with dogs congregate?”
So they go and find dog forums, they find dog emails lists, they find out
where does their potential customer congregate.

I'm saying that because we look at things like safelists and things like that,
yes there are congregations of people there. So if you.re selling something
related to internet marketing or business, that.s a good congregation of
people. If I'm selling a health-related supplement, a safelist is a horrible
place to go. If I'm selling potato guns, a safelist is a horrible place to go
because none of my target audience are in that congregation.

But who are on safelists? People who are looking for business
opportunities and those type of things. Now they may not be the most
effective ways. There are lots more effective ways to target people, but
they.re definitely a group of people who are in traffic exchanges, who are
in these type of things, who are in the biz opp market. So if that.s what
your market is, yeah, that.s a good place to go and mine for customers.

We spend time in all those type of networks because I know there's a huge
group of people who are in there with their business opportunities and
they're all business opportunity seekers.

But when I'm going into other markets, I'm not going to spend time with
safelists because safelists are not a great place to find people who want to
lose weight or who want to whatever the other niches are that you might
be in.

So it comes back to any kind of marketing, figuring out first who is your
target customer, and secondly where do they congregate, and third how do
I get my message in front of them.
That's all that marketing is basically. When I work with any client that's
what I do.

1. Who are you targeting?
2. Where do they congregate?
3. How can we get our message in front of them?

Whether it be an ad on their forum, whether it be pay per click ads,
whether it be getting in their email, or whatever it is. You.ve just got to
find that group of people and get your message in front of them.

So if you're new and you're getting started, go the easiest route. Where
are your people congregating? They're probably in some kind of forum
somewhere. So you go to that forum and you figure out ways to advertise.

1. Can I get a banner ad?
2. Do they have Adsense on there? If so, can I do site targeting on that
forum?
3. I can post messages and have my signature file.
4. I can figure out ways to advertise where that congregation of people is
at.

Then you go to the next market and the next market. That's the easiest
way to get started in this business because that.s the whole power of the
internet. That's the whole secret is that people are congregating together.

You've just got to figure out how to tap into that congregation and suck
people out of that onto your list and back into your personal congregation
that you.re building for yourself.

Does that kind of help hopefully? I guess that was a typed-in question and
they can't answer. [laughing]

Mike: “Thanks very much, Russell. That was great!” [laughing] Yeah, Reverend
Ted is a good friend of ours. Great answer there, Russell.

We're going to take our last question. We're going to take it from the
conference line.

Congratulations! You made the cut for the last question here in the
product. Please state your name, where you're from, and ask the question.

Caller: I'm really excited. My name is David. I'm in the little town of Bellwood,
about an hour north of Toronto. I've been struggling with the internet. I've
been doing a lot of things with wealth creation, not online but through
seminars, and I want to expand it through.

One of the things that I keep running into that I haven't got a real good
clear picture on yet is using squeeze pages and capture pages. I understand
it all, but then I see you guys and every time I buy one of your products
I.ve got to sign up for some kind of membership site.

I guess really my question is is the membership site something that we
really need to get into, and if so where can we get really good software or
maybe you can recommend something, or how did you guys do it? How
did you get started in building out that membership site, because I really
think the membership site concept is going to be huge going forward.

Mike: Well, I started building my own sites and then I took that technology and I
wrapped it into exactly what your question is. That's what
ButterflyMarketing.com is. It sells the software that runs all of my sites
that create the viral campaign where somebody gives their name and email
address and is given a link to help promote the site and get paid on
upgrades.

If you're looking to create communities, that.s our other software, which
is Vtribes, which is currently at VisionGatePortal.com, which goes live at
Vtribes with different benefits at twice the price on November 1. So if you
want to get grandfathered in you go to www.VisionGatePortal.com.

So Vtribes, that technology is more about creating a membership site
where the community creates the content and interacts with each other.

Butterfly Marketing software, I wouldn.t necessarily call it a membership
site. I would call it software that allows people to create a user name and
password where they can log in and it allows you to provide a free offer to
them and then provide them with an upgraded offer later and manage all
the content inside of the members area on a one-on-one basis from you to
that consumer, and provide them tools to help them spread the word.

That's the software that runs my business, Butterfly Marketing, and I
made it public for everyone to use.

Caller: Great! And Russell, yourself?

Russell: I.ve used Butterfly Marketing on some sites. I actually emailed Mike
earlier about Vtribes. We're going to be trying that out on another site.
The one we use for most of our sites is a free software called Drupal. The
problem with Drupal is you probably have to hire some kind of developer
to get it set up and running for you because it's not something you can just
plug in out of the box, but it's really powerful when you do start using it.

There's a lot of other free ones like Zoomla, Drupal, and things like that,
but again for most of those you need to hire someone to actually install
them and set it up so it works really well for you, where some of these
other ones like Vtribes and stuff, they work right out of the box.

Caller: That's great. I really appreciate it. You guys have done a fabulous job and
I.m really proud to be the last guy!

Mike: Well, thank you very much! We appreciate it.

Folks, we went just over three hours. I.ll give you a quick wrap-up on
what we're doing.
We're going to take this call and convert it to an mp3. We're going to
have it transcribed, then we.re going to have an internet marketer read it
so that they don't have words like "Sneaker Fulfillment Services" when
it's supposed to be "Speaker Fulfillment Services," which really upsets me
when I read these transcripts.
So we're going to provide you with a quality pdf with the transcripts and a
quality mp3 that you can listen to again when you listen to this call.

Then I'm going to take this pdf and I'm going to put The 12 Month
Internet Millionaire in the footer of every single page for Russell
Brunson's product, which now sells for $97.

I'm going to brand that so that when you create the pdf you.re going to
say your name and your Clickbank ID, and then you're going to click
"submit" and it's going to generate the pdf for you, and the footer of every
single page in this pdf will have your affiliate link to 12 Month
Millionaire.

So if somebody clicks on that, you'll get paid for 12 Month Millionaire.
We'll certainly take this part out of the audio and the transcripts for you.
Then I'll have a sales page written or I.ll write it myself. I'll have my in-
house graphics guy that works right here in my office design a killer mini
site for you with a thank-you page and everything like that.

I'm going to get it Clickbank approved and then we.ll release that. We
promise that you'll have that before the end of the year. I promise it'll be
much sooner, but we said it.ll be before the end of the year, and then
you.ll have a product to sell that could make you some money on the back
end. The recommended price is $47.

Any questions, please go to the forum where you got the information to
get on this call.

So to wrap this up, folks, Russell, I want to thank you very much for
coming on and doing this bonus call that I never even asked you for. I just
threw a video out there on the internet and I said, “This is what Russell.s
going to do.”

I called your cell, you probably saw the caller ID, in fact I think this is the
first time that I'm talking to you since I made that commitment. We never
even spoke other than email in the last couple days, so I think it.s funny.

I want to thank you for coming on, for allowing me to participate in your
promotion, for putting that great prize of the Hummer out there, and for
coming on and allowing me to grill you and give such great great content,
I mean literally opening up your doors for everybody.

It was my pleasure to do the same. I want to thank all the people that
asked these great questions and attended. I have to tell you I.ve done some
three-hour calls before where I.m doing my email and I.m bored out of
my mind, and this call really felt like it was a half hour and I didn.t want it
to end.

So Russell, I'm going to turn it over to you for the final word. When
you.re done we'll open up the line at least on the AccuConference and
we.ll let everybody say goodbye to us and we.ll wrap up the call, so over
to you, Russell, for the final thoughts.

Russell: Well, Mike, I appreciate it. It's funny, I got a call from one of my buddies
at about 11:30 at night. He called me, I was sound asleep, he had my wife
wake me up and he said, “Did you see Mike.s email?” and I said no.

So he read me the whole email and said, “Yeah, he said he tried to call
your cell phone three or four times and you.re doing this big huge call”
and on and on on. He's like, “Are you ok with that?”

I was like, “Yeah, that'll be fine.” Then the next morning I actually got a
chance to read it and I was excited for it just for the fact that I wish
something like this was out when I first got started.

You were mentioning when I told you our sales goal for next year how
you.re on the exact same path. We started at about the same time and our
businesses have been similar in a lot of things and the progression of them,
and now we.re trying to get to the next level of this stuff, some of the
more deep things, and how you can really make a lot of money.

It took you and I this long to figure out these kinds of things, and I wish
that when I got started someone would have shared these things with me
so I knew where the eventual goal was, so I knew what I was working
towards, because we had to figure out a lot of this stuff along the way.

Some people might be discouraged and say, “Well, I.m not ready to do
that kind of stuff yet,” but I hope you look at this as a good road map of
where you need to go, where your long-term goals are and your long-term
plans.

That way it's going to help you as you.re structuring your business now,
as you.re creating your products, and as you.re doing these type of things
to build the type of business that you want.

Again, Mike, I just appreciate you. I've been a big fan of yours since day
one when we met. It.s been fun. I've been able to work beside you a lot
and with you and just to see your progression and growth also. It.s been a
ton of fun and I appreciate you putting this together. I wish we could do
these more often.

I think both of us probably benefited as much if not more than everybody
else on the call, so I appreciate you putting this together and helping with
our promotion and getting these products and this value into as many
people.s hands as possible, so thank you again.

Thank you everyone for spending time with us today. Hopefully you guys
will continue to grow your businesses and hopefully we.ll have a chance
to meet you at one of our workshops or one of our seminars. I look
forward to seeing you guys all again, and seeing you again too, Mike.

Mike: Great. And Russell before you hang up, I.m going to open up the lines in
about five seconds to let everyone the line – and Tom.s actually going to
open up the other two conference lines – and we.re going to let everybody
say goodbye.

I.ll keep the lines open for 30 seconds and everybody can say goodbye,
and then we.ll wrap it up.
Take care everybody! We had a great time. Thank you very much. The
call lines are going to be opened right now. Please say your goodbyes and
we.ll see you soon and meet everyone in the members forum.